Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

General things you want to know. Stamps you can't identify. Catalogue values you need to establish. Advice on ANYTHING stamp related you want. SOMEONE might be able to help. You can post photos of the stamps right here to assist . NOTE: - We have a nearby Forum for basic questions from *NEW* collectors.

Moderator: Volunteer Moderator Team

Post Reply
User avatar
Global Administrator
The Sheriff
The Sheriff
Posts: 64845
Joined: 18 Apr 2007 22:57
Location: Tombstone
Contact:

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by Global Administrator »

lesbootman wrote:
14 Oct 2021 01:50

p.s. I see the sender didn't manage to get cds cancels on the stamps he/she used.


It is Britain after all. :lol: :lol: :lol:

They do not get taxes on most stamps exported it seems clear, (and on a ton imported as well) and they are too dumb to cancel most stamps, even if senders ask nicely, so a vast chunk of the frankings then get re-used. Dumb as Dirt!

NEXT, they'll be talking about voting to leave the EU for some strange reason. 8-)

Glen
.
Click HERE to see superb, RARE and unusual stamps, at FIXED low nett prices, high rez photos, and NO buyer fees etc!

User avatar
ViccyVFU
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
Posts: 4007
Joined: 23 Feb 2018 23:49
Location: Harrogate, UK

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by ViccyVFU »


Well, this is awkward, but I'll try to reply "as diplomatically as possible" .......
Global Administrator wrote:
14 Oct 2021 01:44
.
I do get easily confused, so maybe others can explain for me.

A collector member here mailed me a stamp he had no use for, in this envelope received today.

No CN22 label on it.
If the envelope contained goods, then it should have had a CN22 attached.
I think we've established: "That is now the correct procedure, IN ALL CASES".
However, a CN22 gives no extra liability to the sender, it merely alerts the receivers customs / tax people "how to treat the contents".

Global Administrator wrote:
14 Oct 2021 01:44

I liked the stamp, and sent him 100 quid.

So he has to now send 20 quid to HM Vatman??

Or do I need to?

Or do we both need to?
There is no VAT on exports, irrespective whether they are a private seller, or a registered VAT outfit.
YOU are responsible for all inbound applicable taxes, be that GST, or other duties the Australian Govt decides are relevant.
Whether it had a CN22 on it, or not, YOU are liable to report the import, and any tax you think might be due, to the authorities, to ensure you meet your responsibilities as IMPORTER.

Global Administrator wrote:
14 Oct 2021 01:44

Or is he supposed to declare it on his next tax return?
Not if he was a private seller, and he did not meet the transactional requirements of "badges of trade".
The taxman does not chase tiddly amounts. You can sell some of your surplus occasionally, but it only needs reporting if you are doing it "commercially trading".

Global Administrator wrote:
14 Oct 2021 01:44
How many forms do we need to fill out for this?

And if I offered him only 1 quid for it, there is still 20 pence owed to someone, somewhere, someday, correct? Same principle - goods are being exported for gain.
Couldn't tell you for the Australia side of things.
Best get yourself down to the tax office, and ask for 20,000 other possible offences to be taken into account.


As for the CDS cancellations, lesbootman, what were you thinking?

This is a standard letter, possibly placed in a post box, but even if it was handed over the counter, it would not be CDS'd as its "a standard letter". I'm actually amazed that all four of the stamps contain cancellations sufficient to prevent re-use ....... but if this was offered "with intent to re-use", then an offence would be committed by the vendor, who is ..... :D


It seems virtually all the criminality would occur ~"in the country it was shipped to".
(Considering what we shipped there previously, I'm not surprised!! :D )


User avatar
norvic
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
Posts: 22354
Joined: 25 Feb 2008 21:51
Location: Norfolk, England
Contact:

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by norvic »

Actually the fishing stamp isn’t cancelled and the wheelchair one has the SWLF arrival mark.
Ian Billings - Norvic Philatelics - Remember almost everything I picture is available, unless otherwise stated or copied from elsewhere, as I reduce a roomful of 'stuff' - just ask. GB stamps info: https://blog.norphil.co.uk, NPhilatelics on twitter, www norphil.co.uk, shop.norphil.co.uk for our e-commerce site

User avatar
Global Administrator
The Sheriff
The Sheriff
Posts: 64845
Joined: 18 Apr 2007 22:57
Location: Tombstone
Contact:

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by Global Administrator »

image0-005.jpg


norvic wrote:
14 Oct 2021 08:35

Actually the fishing stamp isn’t cancelled, and the wheelchair one has the SWLF arrival mark.

Wrong actually, fishing stamp has pink sorting centre bars all through it. :lol:

All postal markings applied on all 4 stamps, were added in AUSTRALIA.

A paltry 2 and a half quid potential loss, a few million times over is clearly meaningless to Royal Mail! Sort of highlights the big picture issues there.

I think I'll all report this to Boris. :lol:

Global Administrator wrote:
14 Oct 2021 01:44
.
I do get easily confused, so maybe others can explain for me.

A collector member here mailed me a stamp he had no use for, in this envelope received today.

No CN22 label on it.

I liked the stamp, and sent him 100 quid.

So he has to now send 20 quid to HM Vatman??

Or do I need to?

Or do we both need to?

Or is he supposed to declare it on his next tax return?

How many forms do we need to fill out for this?

And if I offered him only 1 quid for it, there is still 20 pence owed to someone, somewhere, someday, correct? Same principle - goods are being exported for gain.

For some reason I am reminded of John Hewson, Federal Opposition leader here in 1993, before GST/VAT was introduced here decades back - this classic bungling interview lost him a certain Election, and GST was then firmly off the table for 10 years!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birthday_cake_interview

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WndWM71-jSQ


Image
.
Click HERE to see superb, RARE and unusual stamps, at FIXED low nett prices, high rez photos, and NO buyer fees etc!

User avatar
norvic
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
Posts: 22354
Joined: 25 Feb 2008 21:51
Location: Norfolk, England
Contact:

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by norvic »

The red barcode certainly looks like the sort applied in the UK, but they weren’t clear on my iPad, screen to bright.

The top cancellation looks like this to me but you have the advantage of having it in your hand. Pray tell us what it actually is?

Apparent Royal Mail postmark applied to outgoing Mail.
Apparent Royal Mail postmark applied to outgoing Mail.
Ian Billings - Norvic Philatelics - Remember almost everything I picture is available, unless otherwise stated or copied from elsewhere, as I reduce a roomful of 'stuff' - just ask. GB stamps info: https://blog.norphil.co.uk, NPhilatelics on twitter, www norphil.co.uk, shop.norphil.co.uk for our e-commerce site

User avatar
Global Administrator
The Sheriff
The Sheriff
Posts: 64845
Joined: 18 Apr 2007 22:57
Location: Tombstone
Contact:

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by Global Administrator »

.
Capture.JPG



Hard to read .. might be Lancs - you are right -- I lose track of all those ever-changing country names, as indeed do most Brits. :D

Here we do not go changing them ad hoc every few decades. They stay the same, curious as that idea might sound. As it works.

Look at your own bizarre and convoluted UK County names. 90% of Brits could not point to a map of the UK and show you exactly where RUTLAND County was. :lol:

I bet if you walked into a classroom of 15 year olds today in London, and asked them to name all the British Counties, ZERO would be able to. Can you? You could ask the entire school, all teachers included, and no-one would know them all, without looking it up.

Any classroom in the USA (50 states) or Australia WILL give you many correct answers to the VERY simple questions of how many states they have.

Do you even know the answer to - "how MANY Counties are there in Britain"? Without looking it up, I bet you do not. :!:

And this is before all the dozens of often bizarre sounding Welsh and Scot and Irish ones are added into the wacky mixmaster. :lol:

The absurd answer, to save you looking, for GB alone, is -

Historic (39)
Ceremonial (48)
Metropolitan and non‑metropolitan (82)



Sounds like Sir Humphrey Appleton & Co was in charge of County names and borders too -

''In total, there are 39 unitary authorities that do not have the same name as any of the ceremonial counties. Bedfordshire, Cheshire and Northamptonshire are counties that consist of a number of unitary authorities, none of which has the same name as the ceremonial county.

The Local Government Act 1972 abolished the 1888 act, its administrative counties and county boroughs. In their place, the 1972 Act created new areas for handling local government that were also called administrative counties. The 1972 administrative counties differed distinctly in area from the 1888 administrative counties, that had now been abolished, and from the traditional counties, that had still not been abolished.

Many of the names of the traditional counties were still being used now for the 1972 administrative counties. Later legislation created yet further area differences between the 1972 administrative counties and the traditional counties. As of 2020, for the purpose of administration, England outside Greater London and the Isles of Scilly is divided into 82 metropolitan and non-metropolitan counties.

The Lieutenancies Act 1997 created areas to be used for the purpose of the Lieutenancies Act. These newly created areas are called ceremonial counties and are based on, but not always the same as, the areas of the 1972 administrative counties.''



etc, etc, into more totally convoluted daft gibberish! The same guy went on to write the Taxation Act. :lol:

I've sent Boris a simple fix - the UK will be just 7 simple countries, you CAN all remember, and work out instantly where anyone lives.

1. North Scotland (until Independence)
2. South Scotland (until Independence)
3. West England (once called Wales)
4. Northern Ireland (for as long as it is stays unmerged with the rest of Eire)
5. North England
6. East England
7. South England


Even school kids for the first time will know where they live. :!:

And 99% of the country will now know all the countries, instead of the present 99% who do not.

England is an absolutely tiny place geographically, and this will work perfectly.

You can literally fit the whole place into South Australia 7.6 times!

A simple Knighthood is all I'll be asking for the overdue simplification, as I hear the well is dry over there this year with all these botched Tax regimes? 8-)

Glen


Capturegg.JPG
.
Click HERE to see superb, RARE and unusual stamps, at FIXED low nett prices, high rez photos, and NO buyer fees etc!

User avatar
lesbootman
I was online for Post Number 7 MILLION!
I was online for Post Number 7 MILLION!
Posts: 16824
Joined: 23 May 2012 23:32
Location: Bury, England

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by lesbootman »

Global Administrator wrote:
14 Oct 2021 18:30

And 99% of the country will now know all the countries, instead of the present 99% who do not.
Glen, I suspect that more than 1% of the population would know that the UK is made up of four countries:

England, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales (ordered alphabetically).

Also I can see that you've spent time in Wales and know how readily the people there would accept being residents of West England :lol: :lol:
Our days are happier when we give people a bit of our heart rather than a piece of our mind!

User avatar
norvic
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
Posts: 22354
Joined: 25 Feb 2008 21:51
Location: Norfolk, England
Contact:

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by norvic »

Global Administrator wrote:
14 Oct 2021 18:30
.
Image



Hard to read .. might be Lancs - you are right -- I lose track of all those ever-changing country names, as indeed do most Brits. :D
The country is not mentioned in the postmark.

This map is over 400 years old; apart from a few boundary changes the area known as Lancashire has been thus for centuries. Hardly 'ever changing names'.


Wikipedia: 1610 map of Lancashire area.
Wikipedia: 1610 map of Lancashire area.
Ian Billings - Norvic Philatelics - Remember almost everything I picture is available, unless otherwise stated or copied from elsewhere, as I reduce a roomful of 'stuff' - just ask. GB stamps info: https://blog.norphil.co.uk, NPhilatelics on twitter, www norphil.co.uk, shop.norphil.co.uk for our e-commerce site

User avatar
lesbootman
I was online for Post Number 7 MILLION!
I was online for Post Number 7 MILLION!
Posts: 16824
Joined: 23 May 2012 23:32
Location: Bury, England

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by lesbootman »

Hmm, is that why Lancashire County Cricket Club's home ground (Old Trafford) isn't in Lancashire?

The bus company serving Greater Manchester used to be known as SELNEC when I first moved to these parts and the buses were orange and white. SELNEC stood for South East Lancashire North East Cheshire. What used to be South East Lancashire contained a fair chunk of the population of Lancashire. Somewhat more significant than a minor border tweak.

P.S. Apologies for going off topic.
Our days are happier when we give people a bit of our heart rather than a piece of our mind!

User avatar
Global Administrator
The Sheriff
The Sheriff
Posts: 64845
Joined: 18 Apr 2007 22:57
Location: Tombstone
Contact:

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by Global Administrator »

lesbootman wrote:
14 Oct 2021 18:57

Also I can see that you've spent time in Wales and know how readily the people there would accept being residents of West England :lol: :lol:

They'll get over it, and make up a sweet song about it. No-one understands them, so who'd know what they THUNK?! It is the size of a very small cattle station so one name is plenty. There is one country with the weird name of Powys which has only 130,000 people! An AFL football stadium here holds that. ''West England'' it is.

They also are also changing all the time, so they'll really appreciate my simplification - and Ystalyfera and Ystradgynlais will just have to live with it. No-one on this board could rattle off all the Counties of the UK. Absurd.

The Local Government Boundary Commission for Wales were instructed by the National Assembly for Wales on 11 March 2002 to undertake a review of preserved county boundaries. In their final proposals the part of the local government area of Caerphilly which had been in Mid Glamorgan was to be part of Gwent and the part of the local government area of Conwy which had been in Gwynedd was to be part of Clwyd.

The boundary between Mid Glamorgan and South Glamorgan was also to be re-aligned to reflect small changes in local government boundaries. The Assembly accepted these proposals such that from 2 April 2003 each preserved county encompassed between one and five whole local government areas.

The boundary between West Glamorgan and Powys was further modified on 1 April 2005 as a result of boundary changes between Ystalyfera and Ystradgynlais.

The boundary between Mid Glamorgan and Powys was further modified on 1 April 2010 to reflect the 2009 local government boundary changes in the area around Vaynor, Merthyr Tydfil.
.
Click HERE to see superb, RARE and unusual stamps, at FIXED low nett prices, high rez photos, and NO buyer fees etc!

User avatar
ViccyVFU
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
Posts: 4007
Joined: 23 Feb 2018 23:49
Location: Harrogate, UK

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by ViccyVFU »


Shouldn't you concentrate on getting the place names right in your own back yard?

aiatsis.jpg
AIATSIS map of first nation place names

This "monotonous, yet predictable ramble" has nothing to do with the topic title.

Did you let your border force know about the imported goods, for assessment of all applicable taxes......
and are you saying that you want CN22 labels (or the other form, on bigger shipments) "on all sendings from the UK"?


User avatar
Global Administrator
The Sheriff
The Sheriff
Posts: 64845
Joined: 18 Apr 2007 22:57
Location: Tombstone
Contact:

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by Global Administrator »

.
No, you are confused. :lol:

Those are from a tiny part of the STATE of NSW. Big place (GB fits into NSW alone 4 or 5 times) - ONE name for 233 years. Not 50 or 100 regular changing ''counties''.

They are obscure names relating to alleged Aboriginal tribal areas. Never seen most of them before in my lifetime. The Romans gave strange names for most of the UK too as I recall? Many 100s of them like these below that I am sure you too, have never seen before -

Aballava - Burgh by Sands, Cumbria
Ad Ansam - Unknown (Higham, Suffolk?)
Ad Pontem - East Stoke, Nottinghamshire
Ad Pontes or Pontibus - Staines-upon-Thames, Middlesex
Aesica - Great Chesters, Northumberland
Alaunodunum - Maidenhead, Berkshire
Alione or Alavana - Watercrook or Low Borrowbridge, Cumbria?
Alauna - Maryport, Cumbria
Alaune - Alcester, Warwickshire
Amboglanna - Birdoswald, Cumbria
Anderitum - Pevensey, East Sussex
Aquae Arnemetiae - Buxton, Derbyshire
Aquae Sulis - Bath, Somerset

And 100s more.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Roman_place_names_in_Britain


Capture.JPG
.
Click HERE to see superb, RARE and unusual stamps, at FIXED low nett prices, high rez photos, and NO buyer fees etc!

User avatar
OldDuffer1
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
WINNER! Stampboards Poster Of The Month
Posts: 6538
Joined: 20 Feb 2012 02:32
Location: EDINBURGH, UK

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by OldDuffer1 »

Certainly at least ebay.de has stopped adding 20% to all items to be sent to the UK- presumably most sellers are not registered as "business" sellers?

As mentioned previously Delcampe gives 2 options- use Delcampe Pay and pay an extra 25% up front or risk that duty might be applied. I wonder which most people are choosing...?

User avatar
Derbyboi2
BLUE Shooting Star Posting GURU!!
BLUE Shooting Star Posting GURU!!
Posts: 906
Joined: 06 May 2020 08:01
Location: London, England

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by Derbyboi2 »

I received a consignment from a major Australian auction house this morning by registered post with a total declared value of $A10. The actual cost of the lot including premium and posting was in the region of $A200.

I was expecting to pay the 5% VAT but the large envelope was unexamined.

Am I to blame accepting it when it arrives on my doorstep! I have no input as to the actions of the auctioneers.

User avatar
Derbyboi2
BLUE Shooting Star Posting GURU!!
BLUE Shooting Star Posting GURU!!
Posts: 906
Joined: 06 May 2020 08:01
Location: London, England

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by Derbyboi2 »

And.......although I was charged $A20 postage there is $26.40 in stamps on the envelope......

User avatar
blue-within-blue
GOLD Star Super Posting Stampboarder!
GOLD Star Super Posting Stampboarder!
Posts: 326
Joined: 11 Nov 2020 06:49
Location: Blackpool, England

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by blue-within-blue »


"I received a consignment from a major Australian auction house this morning by registered post with a total declared value of $A10. The actual cost of the lot including premium and posting was in the region of $A200. I was expecting to pay the 5% VAT but the large envelope was unexamined. Am I to blame accepting it when it arrives on my doorstep! I have no input as to the actions of the auctioneers."

As discussed at length earlier in this topic, the sender has broken the law by knowingly under-declaring the value ; and if detected by Customs / Border Force staff, that offence could have resulted in a fine and/or seizure of the goods with no compensation.

But Customs only examine a proportion of items sent, and if they decide to pass it unexamined, there is no legal requirement for a recipient to volunteer to pay the tax which he suspects may have been due if the packet had been opened and assessed for duty.

Replying to Norvic's question about enforcement of the rules for senders, the details are set out here :
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/civil-penalties-for-contraventio ... notice-301

In short, there are civil penalties of up to £1000 for lesser offences and £2500 for more serious cases ; but HMRC will normally only apply such penalties where the offender has previously received a warning letter for a similar offence. The broad approach is to encourage compliance, and deal lightly with first offenders.

But once someone has had a warning, if they do it again they are rightly treated as knowing they were breaking the rules, so repeat offenders will cop a large fine. For the same reason, traders who have had previous written instructions from HMRC on how to comply don't get that first warning.

ROB

User avatar
Derbyboi2
BLUE Shooting Star Posting GURU!!
BLUE Shooting Star Posting GURU!!
Posts: 906
Joined: 06 May 2020 08:01
Location: London, England

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by Derbyboi2 »

Rob

I don't disagree with you and my question was to an extent rhetorical! Interestingly when I send items of value for expertising I always complete the customs declaration by stating 'Item for expertising and return - no commercial value' but obviously ensuring it is properly insured.

I sent an item to Scott Starling recently with the same declaration and it sailed through without a problem.

Robert

User avatar
peterh
I was online for Post Number 4 MILLION!
I was online for Post Number 4 MILLION!
Posts: 2508
Joined: 16 Jul 2010 08:59
Location: Wales

Re: Customs/Duty/VAT on buying/selling stamps online in UK/EU?

Post by peterh »

Sorry to serious followers of this topic for responding to Glen's off-topic aside:
Global Administrator wrote:
14 Oct 2021 19:44
lesbootman wrote:
14 Oct 2021 18:57

Also I can see that you've spent time in Wales and know how readily the people there would accept being residents of West England :lol: :lol:

They'll get over it...
No we wouldn't :evil:

Post Reply

Return to “You ask the questions - SOMEONE will have the answers!”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests