Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

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traralgon3844
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by traralgon3844 »

My tip is:

Gregra R.S.

PO 20/3/1899; PO 1/3/1907; renamed Gregra PO 12/4/1922.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by BigSaint »

mobbor

When I first looked at this one I thought it was a double strike, with the second "N" being the start of NSW, when it actually was the end of another word.

I rotated your stamp 90 degrees & enlarged your image & it becomes easier to read:


Gregra can be clearly read &amp; Rail appears in top right of rotated image, so:<br /><br />Gregra Railway Station
Gregra can be clearly read & Rail appears in top right of rotated image, so:

Gregra Railway Station

Phoenix entry for Gregra Railway Station.
Phoenix entry for Gregra Railway Station.

:D
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

Postmark reads GREGRA RAILWAY STATION NSW.
Location 5km east of Manildra.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by rsellens »

mobbor wrote:
14 Jun 2021 16:50
Not sure what's happening Ross, but when I go to Phoenix, I see, 'see cowwarr'. When I go to cowwarr, it says 'Renamed fro Upper Heyfield P.O. 1870. LPO 5/10/1993.
Mobbor,
I'm not sure what you mean. I read it as Upper Heyfield PO changed to Cowwar PO in 1870 until became an LPO in 1993. If you look up COWWARR under "all states" (top line) and then right click on "date stamps" to the right you will find 7 different date stamps that were used over the years.

Ross

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by BigSaint »


Ross

I read it the same way:


Phoenix - Upper Heyfield Vic
Phoenix - Upper Heyfield Vic

Phoenix - Cowwarr Vic
Phoenix - Cowwarr Vic

Phoenix says post office opened as Upper Heyfield PO on 1st February 1869 & changed it's name to Cowwarr PO on 22nd August 1870. On 5th October 1993 the Cowwarr PO became an LPO. :D
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Summo »

Hi all,
Located this postmark of Casterton on 9d Roo. Not sure which version of datestamp that it is after looking on Phoenix. Any assistance would be appreciated. Regards, Summo.
E915A7D9-90A6-46C1-A2AE-ED5662B04B4A.jpeg
C3B5AD43-9CE0-421C-B2CC-D1D06DE8C92F.jpeg

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by BigSaint »


Summo ,

Good question. Below are extracts from WWW, the hard copy book which was before Phoenix & PPA:


P D Casterton
P D Casterton

Paid at Casterton
Paid at Casterton

"AI from Paid" &" At " were removed so the CDS could be used as normal date stamp.

My guess is that you have either 90B or 620A, but I will stand to be corrected.

:)
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by traralgon3844 »

BigSaint wrote:
15 Jun 2021 00:06


My guess is that you have either 90B or 620A, but I will stand to be corrected.

:)
Are you standing?

It is not the Paid at Casterton.

Paid at Casterton
Paid at Casterton


Close reading of the dates would suggest it sits between 90B and 90C


Postmark detail P O Casterton
Postmark detail P O Casterton

Postmark detail P O Casterton
Postmark detail P O Casterton
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by BigSaint »

Paul

Thanks for clarifying. I thought 620A was of the same design as 610.

So is earliest date known for 90C now 6th July 1933

:)
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by traralgon3844 »

Looking closely at all examples shown, the small figure seems to jump around a lot. The first one shown (90A) has a small tens day wheel. It changes position on others.

Summos example has a dot after the decade wheel not shown in others examples.

The staff may have been fiddling/repairing it frequently.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by BigSaint »

Paul

90C has a small decade wheel while 90B has a large decade wheel. Wouldn't that mean Summo's is 90B?

Not sure if Summo's dot is not dirt.

:)
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by traralgon3844 »

Summo wrote:
14 Jun 2021 23:34


]Image


90B has an inverted year wheel.

This all depends on what you make the date to be. If it is 32 or 33, it sits in between 90B abnd 90C.


Postmark detail P O Casterton fine.png
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by traralgon3844 »

Having gone through all that, look at the date on the 5d KGV that is said to be 90A. It is actually 90C. The image for 2 Dec seems to be in the wrong position as well.

But Summo's postmark fits between B and C and because we can't see the tens date we will never know.

As I said that solid dot after the 3 worries me. It shows up in another position much later.


Postmark Casterton.png
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by mobbor »

Thank you one and all. Ross we are now actually in agreement.

I was able to work this one out myself.
IMG_20210611_0002 (2).jpg
Apunyal Qld R.O. 11/8/13 P.O. 1/7/27. Closed 8/11/30.
I'm just wondering as to it's scarcity.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

Q. How scarce is Mobbors manuscript cancel ?
A. See below.


2021-06-15_092746.jpg
NOT listed in Dell and Price reference work.
NOT listed in Dell and Price reference work.

Details from Joan Frews reference work.
Details from Joan Frews reference work.

FIRST recorded copy from this office.
4R+.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by traralgon3844 »

Just a ratings question from someone who has access to Western Australia ratings.

Postmark Supt of Mails Perth W.A.. Rubber oval dated 29 Aug 1945.

Was it worth 50 cents?


Postmark Superintendent of Mails Perth.
Postmark Superintendent of Mails Perth.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by mobbor »

Thanks Terry, but I'm a little confused. Apunyal is not recorded in Dell and Price, but that refers to it's brief period as a P.O., doesn't it? And the one with only one recorded copy is Aramac.(?)
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

No. Apunyal accidently got left out of the reference work in the post office A-Z listing.
The manuscript listing records all known types.
So therefore your Apunyal manuscript is the first cancellation from there of ANY type.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by The Pom »

traralgon3844 wrote:
15 Jun 2021 16:03
Just a ratings question from someone who has access to Western Australia ratings.

Postmark Supt of Mails Perth W.A.. Rubber oval dated 29 Aug 1945.

Was it worth 50 cents?



Image

Feibes was a dealer. Could you call this philatelic? Would a dealer have been able to arrange for such a cover/cancel combination to be created? Still worth 50c though!
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

This postmark is not listed in the extensive Perth listing in the WA Compendium.
With the rating system they use it would be rated 1. That is their highest rating.
To me your 50c purchase is worth $50 or more.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by traralgon3844 »

The Pom wrote:
15 Jun 2021 19:27

Feibes was a dealer. Could you call this philatelic? Would a dealer have been able to arrange for such a cover/cancel combination to be created? Still worth 50c though!
I was well aware that FEIBES was a dealer, and I imagine the cover was in answer to him enquiring about getting his hands on some stamps of some sort, Flight covers or similar.

Thanks for the info Terry, my gut feeling was right and is scarcer than the Victorian Supt of Mails postmarks. :) :) :) :mrgreen:


There was another cover to FEIBES I purchased for the same amount (50 cents) that had a RR postmark.


Leongatha Oval Rubber postmark.
Leongatha Oval Rubber postmark.

Leongatha Oval Rubber postmark.
Leongatha Oval Rubber postmark.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Summo »

Hi all, thanks to everyone for your very astute advice and opinions re my last post. Keeping with the Casterton theme I have found this one with a “1” below Casterton directly over the time and date line. Postmark 9A (am) 27JL14. Cannot work out which one of the datestamps this one belongs to. As always any advice gratefully received. Regards, Summo. Think there is also a flaw above first “A” of Australia, any plating advice also much appreciated.
ABA05FD8-BFE5-42C7-92D0-EAD9A1B29A8E.jpeg
3DC7BAD5-ECE7-4D63-97A5-CF591EFE28B5.jpeg

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by rsellens »

Summo wrote:
15 Jun 2021 22:05
Hi all, thanks to everyone for your very astute advice and opinions re my last post. Keeping with the Casterton theme I have found this one with a “1” below Casterton directly over the time and date line. Postmark 9A (am) 27JL14. Cannot work out which one of the datestamps this one belongs to. As always any advice gratefully received. Regards, Summo. Think there is also a flaw above first “A” of Australia, any plating advice also much appreciated.
ImageImage
Can't help with the postmark but it is 1R28.

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by traralgon3844 »

Summo, your Casterton 1 is PPA 250 used between 08 and 34, rated common.

It will have a full VICTORIA around the bottom. Not a keeper for postmark collectors.

As for the plate position, post a clearer image on the Kangaroo thread.


Casterton 1 PPA
Casterton 1 PPA
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by mobbor »

Re Apunyal.

WOW! is right Terry. Thank You.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Summo »

Thanks Ross and Traralgon. I need to look a little harder next time. Regards, Summo.

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by mobbor »

Ubobo.R.O. wrote:
15 Jun 2021 10:54
Q. How scarce is Mobbors manuscript cancel ?
A. See below.



ImageImage
Image


FIRST recorded copy from this office.
4R+.
A woohoo moment for postmark collectors.
Believe it or not, I've found 2 more copies, one with exactly the same date as the one shown above. I guess, no longer 4R+ (?)

Also, I'm finding date stamps beginning with 0. The 1st one was 01, which I assumed was 10. I've since found numbers up to 07, so............?

Dates like 29 Feb. make sense, but how can you get 32 Oct.??
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by BigSaint »

With great difficulty, I would imagine. :lol:
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

mobbor wrote:
29 Jun 2021 11:39
Also, I'm finding date stamps beginning with 0. The 1st one was 01, which I assumed was 10. I've since found numbers up to 07, so............? Dates like 29 Feb. make sense, but how can you get 32 Oct. ??
Can you put up some images of these please Mike ?
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by mobbor »


07 OCT 15.
07 OCT 15.

DE 31, upside down, or is that 13.
DE 31, upside down, or is that 13.

32  DE  14.
32 DE 14.

There are many more!
Last edited by BigSaint on 29 Jun 2021 20:58, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Place In Line used to remove wording attachments
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by BigSaint »

Mike

I suspect your 32 Dec 14 is probably meant to be 23 Dec 14

:D
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

The Dec 31 is just the 13 inserted upside down.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Derbyboi2 »

Perhaps someone can help with one of the markings on this cover (The marking may not be Australian).

The cover started life in Lockart on the 14th January 1899 and bears postage of 5 1/2d being 3d registration fee and 2 1/2d foreign mail. It is addresses to the American Messenger, one of the evangelical publications of the American Tract Society,

Our cover next reaches The Rock on the 16th January and there is another unreadable registered cancellation.

The cover reached London on the 18th February and is cancelled with an oval registered arrival mark on that date and a further Hooded London registration mark of the 19th February 1899. It eventually arrives in the Madison Square branch in New York on the 3rd March 1899.

The mark that is puzzling me is a 'U' containing the letters 3 above 2 inside a circle which bears the number 99. I am presuming this is an arrival date stamp for the 3rd February 1899 but where?

Messenger front.jpg
Messenger back.jpg

Messenger U.jpg

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Kainnikanada »

Robert,

Could be an American Postman's route marking or delivery code.

Just speculation.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Derbyboi2 »

Thanks Rod

It is an odd one. No doubt there will be a definitive answer - you may well be right.

Robert

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by mobbor »

Further to my query above, the 07 is just 7? Also I just found a 1961- 1916?
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

mobbor wrote:
30 Jun 2021 12:25
Further to my query above, the 07 is just 7 ?
Yes.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by BigSaint »

mobbor wrote:
30 Jun 2021 12:25
I just found a 1961- 1916?
Could be 19 inverted, so 1919. Do you have an image?
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Post by mobbor »

IMG_20210630_0001 (2).jpg
Not very easy to see. Upside down it's still 1961. Not sure about the shade.
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Post by BigSaint »

Mike

As you say difficult to see, could be either 1916 or 1919. Maybe the shade may provide a better clue to what it should be.

:)
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

The month, day and year on two lined dated postmarks are all individually inserted.
So all sorts of connations are possible if one is inserted incorrectly.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by mobbor »

Another one.
IMG_20210630_0002 (2).jpg
1172. All Phoenix says is Darlmurla (1) Closed 1895.

Also I found a copy of Lower Acacia Creek, closed 1974. This was mentioned in the Acacia Plateau thread.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

Your 1172 is NSW.

2021-06-30_172446.jpg

Kinchela Creek is north east of Kempsey.
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by mobbor »

Thank you. That really throws a spanner in the works. I wonder how many others I've got wrong.

I thought N.S.W. numeral cancellations were completely different. I haven't seen any images in Phoenix. How do you tell the difference?
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by bluesrule »

This envelope has me beaten.
2000, 09, 16, Olympic Games Opening Ceremony Stamp on cover 001.jpg
I picked up this envelope and several others all associated with the Sydney Olympics when I purchased a Gold Medalists Album at auction a couple of weeks ago. The first day covers and others were effectively just thrown in as extras. The other envelopes, all postmarked Sylvester have dates that are unremarkable. One is a first day cover but without a special "first day cover" envelope or postmark. (I'd never heard of Sylvester until seeing these envelopes).

This envelope though is different. When I look at the postmark it clearly says 16 September 2000 (the day after the opening ceremony) but the stamp was not released until 10 October. What is the go? There doesn't seem to be any intent to defraud as it was not being sold as something special - wasn't even mentioned in the sale - but no post office would backdate a postmark so I don't know what to think. Is it something worth hanging on to?

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by BigSaint »

bluesrule

This postmark, with the original postcode N18 removed in the late 1960s , I would think would have been replaced in the 1970s.

How this came about is purely speculation but whoever created them did so as deliberate error & most likely to make a few $ for themselves as well. It is definitely worth holding onto as a curio.

As you live in Melbourne it might be worthwhile going out to 500 Plenty Road Preston & obtaining postmarks of all those in use at the Post Office now.

Do not take your covers with you. By all means take a photocopy with you & ask when they stopped using that postmark.

:)
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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by The Pom »

BigSaint wrote:
04 Jul 2021 01:58
bluesrule

This postmark, with the original postcode N18 removed in the late 1960s , I would think would have been replaced in the 1970s.
According to Phoenix, the SDL with removed N18:

Earliest date known: 19 May 68

Latest date known: 14 Oct 99.

Like you, I would have expected this to have been replaced in the 70's. That's a remarkably long period of use.
Always on the lookout for Australian pre decimal First Day Covers.

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by bluesrule »

Thanks for the information Big Saint and The Pom. Amazed at how quick you were to respond to the query.

Greatly appreciate the information. Given that I have several covers with this Sylvester postmark that were picked up at the same time and that they are from September/October 2000 (and only the one posted above has any dubiousness about it in terms of when and how it was created) I wonder if the postmark really was still in use in 2000. As it was in known use up to October 1999, it doesn't seem all that hard to believe that it was still in use in the year 2000.

I will definitely take a trip to Sylvester/Preston and following up although there would need to be a long-serving employee there to have any knowledge going back more than 20 years. I can only hope.

Looks like it might be worth holding onto these few postmarked items just because they seem to be a curiosity (and they were only incidental to my larger purchase). Maybe they give evidence that the postmark was in use up to October 2000. They may even be the last (collected) items using what seems to be an old outdated postmark.

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by RogerE »

The Pom wrote:
04 Jul 2021 06:42

According to Phoenix, the SDL with removed N18:

Earliest date known: 19 May 68

Latest date known: 14 Oct 99.

Like you, I would have expected this to have been replaced in the 70's. That's a remarkably long period of use.
As a "casual" visitor to this thread, may I request an expansion/explanation of the acronym "SDL"?
Other occasional readers here might also appreciate it...

On second thoughts, there are probably several other related acronyms, such as "CDS" (I'm familiar with that one). Could we have a short list of such acronyms, including SDL, explained in one reply post in this thread? Thanks!

/RogerE :D

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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Post by Territorian »

A few relevant acronyms and expressions:

1. CDS.....................circular date stamp
2. SDL.....................small date line
3. LDL.....................large date line
4. ERD.....................earliest recorded date of usage
5. LRD.....................latest recorded date of usage
6. 'Socked-on-the-nose'...............a centrally-struck cancel showing the whole postmark
7.UF..........................unframed date stamp
8.Duplex.................... two cancels in one.........could be a numeral cancel and an identifying office CDS
9. Index .................... a number or letter above the dateline of the cancel identifying the cancel or time of usage.

Please feel free to add more. Cheers, Mike

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