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Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 09 Jul 2020 07:32
by The Pom
josto wrote:
09 Jul 2020 07:08
Hi,

I think it is "POSTED SHIP SIDE SYDNEY", I've seen several of these on KGV heads.

Greetings

Josto
Correct! See my post from earlier today. :)

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 09 Jul 2020 19:59
by StampLearner
Thanks a lot to you, Mobbor, for the lightning speed plating of my stamp, this saves asking about it at the plating thread. Also to Josto for reminding the exact wording.

To follow the subject, here is a stamp with the word 'ship' in the cancel, obliterated in 1898. I understand it has nothing to do with "posted ship side' cancellation which came later. Did they have "ship mail room" cancel already, or is it something else?
Sydney ship.jpg
Kind regards

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 09 Jul 2020 20:05
by StampLearner
Also a question of this strange looking cancel. Any idea please?
3d - balck blob.jpg

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 09 Jul 2020 20:41
by David Benson
Ship Letter Room, Sydney,

David B.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 09 Jul 2020 20:44
by StampLearner
Thank you, David !

When did these rooms start to operate?

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 10 Jul 2020 21:17
by StampLearner
Please, could anyone comment on the strange looking cancel on 3d Roo, and also tell me when they started to use "ship mail room" cancel ?

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 10 Jul 2020 22:36
by The Pom
The ink blot on the Roo:

My guess is there was no postmarker to hand, so someone took it upon themselves to obliterate the stamp using whatever they had to hand.

The old fashioned equivalent of the dreaded biro lines we see today.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 11 Jul 2020 04:28
by StampLearner
Thank you, The Pom !

I thought about it too, but the blob looks like reversed 2 or 5, so it wasn't just whaterver, unless it's my imagination.

Meanwhile, do you know when exactly they started to use "ship mail room" cancel ? Or is it "ship letter room" cancel on my N.S.W. stamp shown a couple of days ago?

Kind regards

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 11 Jul 2020 06:13
by RLMS
Looking for help with this NSW numeral please. The shape and length of the first digit (1 or 7?) looks wrong and does not match either 150 or 750 on my CD.
PM.jpg
Any help greatly appreciated.

Richard

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 11 Jul 2020 08:25
by David Benson
stamplearner,

It is SHIP MAIL ROOM and the handbook states 1898, no date mentioned,

David B.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 11 Jul 2020 11:33
by muttly2011
RLMS - it is 750. The 7 is under-inked. Ignore the ink mark from the Queen's eye over the bridge of the nose.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 11 Jul 2020 13:03
by RLMS
Muttly2011

Many thanks for that.

Richard

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 11 Jul 2020 18:17
by StampLearner
to David B

I see the date, but to make sure what it is, "ship mail room" or "ship letter room", the latter being in existance already in mid-19th c., I understand, I need to know when exactly those "ship mail rooms" started to operate.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 11 Jul 2020 18:43
by muttly2011
Stamplearner,

'The Postal History of New South Wales' by John S. White gives the earliest date for the SHIP MAIL ROOM, SYDNEY N.S.W postmark as 24th September, 1898.

You obviously have one that is earlier than was known to him.

The Ship Letter Room cancels from the 1850's (up until 1868) that you refer to did not have the words 'Ship Letter Room' on them - they had 'SYDNEY N.S.W' and 'SYDNEY NEW SOUTH WALES'.

There was also a 'SHIP LETTER' Sydney cancel (I have one from 1887) but it did not have 'ROOM' on it. Also a 'SHIP ROOM SYDNEY NSW' cancels that were in use in the 1910's - I'm not sure when they started.

The 'LOOSE SHIP LETTER' cancels from the 1860's onwards were a double ringed oval with 'LOOSE SHIP' on the top line and 'LETTER' on the base.

There was at least one oval three-lined LOOSE SHIP LETTER (with SHIP on the second line) that had only one ring.

Other 'PAQUEBOT' and 'LOOSE SHIP LETTER' cancels were in rectangular frames.
Loose Ship LEtter.jpg

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 11 Jul 2020 19:50
by StampLearner
Thank you so much muttly2011 !

I appreciate your highly qualified answer, all the details and an illustration.

It looks I should consider the cancel on my stamp as an earlier example of "ship mail room". Could it be 'ship letter' Sydney cancel, or it has to be capitalised? Was that cancel round as well?

I hope, I do not overload you with too many questions. Finding this type of info is not easy.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 11 Jul 2020 20:32
by muttly2011
StampLearner,

Yours is one of these:
Ship Mail room 1901.jpg
Shown approximately in position:
Ship Mail room composite.JPG
This is a SHIP LETTER Sydney cancel from 1887:
Ship letter Sydney 1887.jpg

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 11 Jul 2020 20:46
by StampLearner
Thank you very much indeed, muttly2011 !

This is very convincing.

Best wishes !!!

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 15 Jul 2020 17:19
by suluc1
Came across this today amongst many wrappers.

1895 WA frank stamp Perth Oct 1. Some research resulted in the full reference to the text on rear, Proclamation of Esperance as a municipality.
My question what is R.L.?

Thanks in advance
Western Australia frank 1895
Western Australia frank 1895
Western Australia frank rear 1895
Western Australia frank rear 1895
Western Australia Proclamation 1895
Western Australia Proclamation 1895

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 16 Jul 2020 21:36
by StampLearner
Hi to all,

Here is a 3d KGV stamp with POSTED OUT (something else?) and L.F.O. before SYDNEY.
May I ask someone to tell me what L.F.O. means, and also to comment on the cancel.
3d_cancel-L.F.O.jpg
Kind reards

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 16 Jul 2020 21:44
by Ubobo.R.O.
POSTED OUT OF COURSE. LATE FEE OFFICE SYDNEY.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 16 Jul 2020 22:05
by StampLearner
Thank you, but what does 'of course' mean here?

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 16 Jul 2020 22:19
by The Pom
Posted out of course was used when someone affixed the correct rate for registration to the letter, crossed it with registration lines, and then put it in a post box, rather than handing it over at the post office counter, thus bypassing the registration process.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 16 Jul 2020 22:22
by StampLearner
Oh, I see, now the use of 'of course' is quite clear.
Thank you very much, The Pom !

The only question remaining, the letter after 'T" does not look like 'O' due to having angular outlines and something resembling a middle bar.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 16 Jul 2020 22:26
by StampLearner
I'll make a close-up and post it a little later.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 16 Jul 2020 23:37
by StampLearner
Here is the close-up , looks like H or F + something after it.
fragment.jpg

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 16 Jul 2020 23:44
by Ubobo.R.O.
It may say POSTED ON TRAIN. Retroveal may help.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 17 Jul 2020 00:52
by StampLearner
Thank you, Ubobo.R.O., this looks much closer to what it is. Here is a reversed scan to support your suggestion.
уюпю.jpg
ALso I found a scan from some auction with a similar cancel, only there is a gap between "ON" and "TRAIN" while none is on mine. Might have been varieties of cancels though.
post_train.jpg
Kind regards

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 17 Jul 2020 07:55
by Browny
suluc1 wrote:
15 Jul 2020 17:19
Came across this today amongst many wrappers.

1895 WA frank stamp Perth Oct 1. Some research resulted in the full reference to the text on rear, Proclamation of Esperance as a municipality.
My question what is R.L.?

Thanks in advance

Image


Image


Image
Hi Suluc1,

The Letters you querie are actually R.P. - Richard Pether was the WA Government Printer from its inception in 1870 until his retirement in 1901.
This Frank Stamp is also known with authorising initials A.C. (Aubrey Curtis -Chief Clerk.), and W.A.W. (WA. Watson - a Superintendent.)

20 April 1894. Post and Telegraph Department Circular No 59.
Official letters must bear a frank stamp as well as initials and office stamp. A sample is given in the margin (The sample was of the Governor of WA frank stamp. Earliest known from 1893) and addressees are requested to procure the neccessary stamps similar to the sample.

Above information is from Karman's 'Frank and Free.'

Cheers,
Browny.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 17 Jul 2020 13:00
by suluc1
Thank you Browny, fantastic to learn about history.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 20 Jul 2020 09:31
by mobbor
L.F.O. SYD(NEY) and POSTED......?

Image

Small watermark p.13½x12½, so around 1930.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 20 Jul 2020 09:40
by Ubobo.R.O.
See a few posts above.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 21 Jul 2020 06:10
by GB 789
Could anyone please identify the postmarks on these stamps and tell me how scarce they are. Many thanks.
75C0DF22-A268-403D-B91F-6F014B0697C0.jpeg
9479329D-8A8A-483B-883E-C830F8509E28.jpeg
25055F32-C3EA-48D7-AF13-D33331C74037.jpeg

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 21 Jul 2020 06:27
by The Pom
Fitzroy Crossing, WA (I think)

Broken Hill, NSW. Very common.

Charters Towers, Queensland. Very common.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 21 Jul 2020 07:46
by mobbor
Thanks again Terry. Quite a co-incidence.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 21 Jul 2020 08:04
by BigSaint
GB 789

To position your image & remove wording attachments from images, press the place in line button:
Place In Line
Place In Line
You find it here:
Place in Line
Place in Line

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:06
by Summo
ECF3D554-77FC-4800-AED5-D80C76D99840.jpeg
Hi all. Hoping that someone may have some information about the cancel on this 1d KGV. Have tried a couple of prefixes but come up with nothing. Regards, Summo.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:14
by Summo
A second one to test the extent of the knowledge base. Not sure how English Mail TPO out postmark can find its way onto an Aussie 1d KGV. Any assistance would be appreciated. Regards, Summo.
896F2831-47FD-4D53-A344-62FC125E7077.jpeg

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:24
by Ubobo.R.O.
ENGLISH MAIL was a TPO on a train that ran from Adelaide to Melbourne.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:24
by BigSaint
It's an Aussie postmark

From PPA:

South Australia - English Mail T.P.O. PO c.1887; closed c.1917.
Victoria - English Mail Travelling Post Office PO c.1887; closed 1/7/1921.

There is a famous or infamous example on thread here on the Board if I can find it. :)

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:28
by The Pom
Summo wrote:
22 Jul 2020 00:06
Image

Hi all. Hoping that someone may have some information about the cancel on this 1d KGV. Have tried a couple of prefixes but come up with nothing. Regards, Summo.
ENOGGERA CAMP, QLD.

PO c.-/3/1915; closed c.1919.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:28
by BigSaint
Summo wrote:
22 Jul 2020 00:06
Image

Hi all. Hoping that someone may have some information about the cancel on this 1d KGV. Have tried a couple of prefixes but come up with nothing. Regards, Summo.
From PPA:

Qld Enoggera Camp PO c.-/3/1915; closed c.1919. :)

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:30
by Summo
Thanks Ubobo R.O. and BigSaint. Some of the material in the PPA has English covers and postmarks so not sure. Regards, Summo

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:32
by Summo
Thanks for the detail on the Enogerra Camp. Now that you have said it, seems all too easy. The postmark looks like it has the year 1914. Could be a mistake, but perhaps not?? Summo.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:32
by The Pom
BigSaint wrote:
22 Jul 2020 00:24
It's an Aussie postmark

From PPA:

South Australia - English Mail T.P.O. PO c.1887; closed c.1917.
Victoria - English Mail Travelling Post Office PO c.1887; closed 1/7/1921.

There is a famous or infamous example on thread here on the Board if I can find it. :)
This one?

Image

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:34
by Ubobo.R.O.
s-l500.jpg

2020-07-21_233644.jpg

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 00:39
by BigSaint
Yes that's the one Chris. :)

Found It but Chris the Pom beat me to it:
Image
STOLEN In Mail: marginal 1913 5/- Roo "ENGLISH MAIL" cancel
https://www.stampboards.com/posting.php?mode=edit&f=13&p=3867986

:D

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 02:12
by cyber
Hello Stampboarders,

can someone help me out with this NSW numeral (the last digit), please?

NSW unclear numeral 121X?
NSW unclear numeral 121X?

Thank you.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 07:52
by Summo
Thanks Ubobo R.O. and BigSaint. Both very nice strikes. Any idea how common they are? Regards Summo.

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 09:16
by BigSaint
Summo

PPA doesn't give a rarity rating for these but they do have a couple for sale.

Ennogera Camp - $8
English on cover - $25 & $30.

:)

Re: Australian stamp cancels and postmarks that have you beaten!

Posted: 22 Jul 2020 21:53
by Summo
Thanks BigSaint,just getting used to a new found resource on my part, PPA. Regards, Summo.