Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts please!

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Lesley
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Lesley »

Help required with this 1d , watermark central.


Image

1. Break in three lines , under Cape Leeuwin.

2. Oblique line between ON of ONE at base.

Image

Thanks ,

Les

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by PhilipAdams »

Hello Les,

According to Adams, Bell and Pope and Sluman you have a copy of (plate)F (pane)L (position)3.

Neither books make mention of the oblique line. Both have the same description "Shading below Albany: diagonal breaks in lines 2 to 4, 1.5mm to 1.0mm from left frame."

I have two examples. Neither have the oblique line, so perhaps incidental.

ABP give a rarity rating of 2 (not very rare).

Philip

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Lesley »

Thanks Philip for you last post.,

I failed to mention that it was the left stamp of a pair. :roll:

I find my old copy off Dormer Legge's descriptions not that easy to understand. :roll: especially his descriptions such as "Flaw in ocean off Roo's head"


Need further help with this pair ( water mark central).

Ist stamp .

1. Break in 3rd line under Cape Londonderry 3mm from left frame

2. Small external break in left frame 1mm from bottom left corner.

3. Break in first line just the N in ONE

Image

Image


Stamp 2.
1. Bottom left corner has a weakness where the corner meets

Image

Image


Thanks ,

Les

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by rsellens »

Les

According to Adams, Bell and Pope you have

Stamp 1. FL1 - Shading above Cape Leveque: 0.25mm break in line 5, starting 3.0mm from left frame. The other 2 flaws are not mentioned.

Stamp 2. UCV 79 - Bottom outer frame: Vertical break at the junction of left and bottom frame. Varying in size and length.

Ross

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Lesley »

Thanks Ross, So UCV 79 is now FL2 ? . Having better success with Roo's than KGV's :lol:


Many thanks again,

Les

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by rsellens »

Lesley wrote:Thanks Ross, So UCV 79 is now FL2 ? . Having better success with Roo's than KGV's :lol:


Many thanks again,

Les
Les

Sorry I missed that those two stamps were a pair also. Would you like to post an image of them as a pair to confirm it?

Ross

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Lesley »

Ross,

Whilst retrieving the scans for FL1 and FL2 .I noticed my previous scan for FL3 and 4 , they appear to be contiguous .

Note that there is a elongated Perforation tip on the left pair that fits into the right pair.

Have also scanned rear of the stamps to confirm upper water mark margins

I hope this adds further confirmation for plating UCV 79 as FL2.



Image
Image


Happy to supply any other scans as needed.

Many thanks ,

Les

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by PhilipAdams »

Les, Nice pairs.

On the FL1+FL2, with the possibility that FL2 is UCV79, below is a similar pair without the apparent UCV79-marker on the second stamp (yes, I know it's a fairly ratty example).
Image
To convince the world that you've plated UCV79, you need to convince an expert like David Adams. I showed David your post and he sent me three images of FL1+FL2 without evidence of the UCV79 marker on the second stamp. The images are shown below.
Image
David also said that he had three used examples of UCV79 without vertical and horizontal watermark lines.

So where does that leave us? The answer is that UCV79 maybe one of these flaws that appear in more than one position on the Die II printings. Thanks to your finding, one of those positions might be FL2.

Philip

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Lesley »

Thanks Phillip,
interesting information . Seems that the 1D suffers from similar plating problems with UCVs ,that 9d and 2d have ( similar flaws occurring across a number of positions)

Only have a modest amount off 1Ds to go through. Will post anything interesting.

Thanks,

Les

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Lesley »

Need some help with this ½ d stamp.

ImageImage

Large white flaw above Cape Leveque with ink flaw at the terminus of the flaw.

Thanks ,

Les

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Andy McPandy »

Les, nothing in Pope.



Andrew.

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Lesley »

Andy McPandy wrote:Les, nothing in Pope.



Andrew.

Thanks Andrew ,I anticipated as much. Such a stand out EFO .


Les

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Lesley »

I hope to have better luck with this pair 1d. Hope the left stamp is plate-able.

1. Break in second shade line under value circle (right end )

2. Colour flaw Left lower corner ,joining 1st shade line and inner frame line
Image
Image

Image


Thanks les

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by david3461 »

Hopefully some scans for the 5/- wiki ??

They are from a 2nd watermark strip, and the flaws as listed in the PPA flaw finder:
Image
Image
R11 -

(a) Shortish Spencer's Gulf
(b) Small colour flaw off tip of kangaroo's left ear
(c) NE outline of back sheared off
(d) Colour flaw at extreme left of background

Image

R17-

(a) Break in 9th shading line below last A of AUSTRALIA - close to right frame

Image

R23-

(a) Break in inner frame line at right and adjoining shading line short. 8½mm up
(b) Break in 8th shading line above LL of SHILLINGS
(c) Oval black flaw below junction of right hind leg and tail

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Australia 1d red Kangaroo & Map Paw Question

Post by castores »

Multiple problems with these two stamps but the main thing I'm questioning is the Kangaroo's paw.

I have quite a number of these showing similarities on the shade lines and/or inner frame lines. They look like they came from the same position or more likely the same sheet.

Anyway, it looks like these two were attached. The kangaroo's claw on the first stamp looks like it wants to join the body but the second one definately does. I've looked at the wiki and don't see anything that comes close.

die II

Image

Image

Same order

Image

Image

Also die I
Broken back

Image

Image

Thanks in advance.
Last edited by castores on 06 Apr 2020 21:14, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by PhilipAdams »

Lesley wrote:I hope to have better luck with this pair 1d. Hope the left stamp is plate-able.

1. Break in second shade line under value circle (right end )

2. Colour flaw Left lower corner ,joining 1st shade line and inner frame line
Image
Image

Image


Thanks les
Les,

Nothing in the standard flaw listings - Sluman and Adams, Bell and Pope.

Philip

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Re: Australia 1d red Kangaroo & Map Paw Question

Post by PhilipAdams »

castores wrote:Multiple problems with these two stamps but the main thing I'm questioning is the Kangaroo's paw.

I have quite a number of these showing similarities on the shade lines and/or inner frame lines. They look like they came from the same position or more likely the same sheet.

Anyway, it looks like these two were attached. The kangaroo's claw on the first stamp looks like it wants to join the body but the second one definately does. I've looked at the wiki and don't see anything that comes close.

die II

Image

Image

Same order

Image

Image

Also die I
Broken back

Image

Image

Thanks in advance.
Castores,

A spur on the Kangaroo's front paw is a fairly common and transient inking flaw.

The broken back is of more interest. It could be a constant break, but I can find no example in either Sluman or Adams, Bell and Pope.

Philip

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by mobbor »

I don't collect roos, but have been given '000s of 1d reds to check. Which is the best checklist to buy?
mobbor

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by PhilipAdams »

mobbor,

Lucky you! I strongly recommend you get

1d Red Kangaroo and Map Series The First Stamp of the Commonwealth of Australia
by
David Adams, Bill Bell and Greg Pope,

Printed September 2004.

Published by the authors, but generally available from traders such as Michael Eastick.

Philip

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by mobbor »

Thank you, Philip.

I have a few ½ds and other denominations too, but not enough to warrant purchasing other checklists. Hopefully, I can get answers here.
mobbor

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by castores »

Castores,

A spur on the Kangaroo's front paw is a fairly common and transient inking flaw.

The broken back is of more interest. It could be a constant break, but I can find no example in either Sluman or Adams, Bell and Pope.

Philip
Thank you Philip, I don't have a great deal of 'Roo & Map' stamps.

If you can't find the broken back I suppose it's also transient (but then you never know).

He's an old Roo, his back is broken and he's looking for help!

I appreciate your help.

Peter
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by PhilipAdams »

Image

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by castores »

That's Roger I believe

R.I.P. Roger

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Image
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by swankyspoon »

First apologies for the scan. It's the best I have access to during shutdown. If nothing can be done with this image, I totally understand.

I was going through my Roos and notices a white 'island' to the east of Tasmania. Is this is a known consistent flaw?

Image
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by rsellens »

swankyspoon wrote:First apologies for the scan. It's the best I have access to during shutdown. If nothing can be done with this image, I totally understand.

I was going through my Roos and notices a white 'island' to the east of Tasmania. Is this is a known consistent flaw?

Image
There is no matching island flaw shown in Adams, Bell and Pope. Despite the poor quality of the image this flaw appears to affect lines 5-7 above the "Y" in "Penny". There are similar smaller flaws in CR43 and ER48 but they invovle lines 8 and 9 above the "Y".
ImageImage

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by swankyspoon »

rsellens wrote:There is no matching island flaw shown in Adams, Bell and Pope. Despite the poor quality of the image this flaw appears to affect lines 5-7 above the "Y" in "Penny". There are similar smaller flaws in CR43 and ER48 but they invovle lines 8 and 9 above the "Y".
Thanks! For the record, here's a better scan. (Better scanning is going to keep me busy going through my collection through COVID).

Image[/URL]
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Kipling »

Can anyone throw any light on the grey printing that surrounds most of the map, shifted to the right? Looks to be the same colour as the Roo. The yellow outline is a bit odd too?

Image
Image
Image
Image

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by The Pom »

I would suggest that someone has been round the coast with a pen of some sort.
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Kipling »

The Pom wrote:I would suggest that someone has been round the coast with a pen of some sort.
The stamp itself doesn't look like that, but the enlargement does.
Still that's probably all it is, and I'm sorry I wasted forum space with it.
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by stallzer »

Is this a listed re-touch / re-entry at base of letter "A" on inner frame line? Small multiple WM.



Image


Image
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by david3461 »

Hi stallzer

The flaw finder from Premier postal auctions shows a similar flaw to yours and lists it as U1 - presumably an unidentified position..

Cheers David

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by stallzer »

I appreciate your help David.

Can someone identify this perfin? Appears ODV


Image


Image
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by The Pom »

Always on the lookout for Australian pre decimal First Day Covers.

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by The Pom »

I'm stuck on this one.

Second watermark with shading line in gulf almost completely absent.

I've referred to the splendid flaw reference at:

https://www.premierpostal.com/cgi-bin/wsProd.sh/view-bierror ... &minor=yes

But it doesn't quite fit with any of the flaws shown. There's a bit of the line remaining at left, which doesn't tie in with anything shown.

It's similarish to a couple of positions, but lacks the required secondary flaws.

Any thoughts welcome.

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by stallzer »

Thanks Chris.
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Kainnikanada »

Chris,

It's L54. Secondary flaws aare the broken portions of the value circle [at] 1 o'clock. Might be a vertical watermark line at right to confirm.


Here' my example form a NWPI block of 30 so irrefutable!
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by The Pom »

Brilliant, thanks Rod, I stared straight though that one.

Watermark on mine is central, but it's still a spot on match as far as the flaws go.

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by GB 789 »

I noticed the double print/kiss print on this pair of 2/- Kangaroo stamps (OS punctured) in this lot of 10 on eBay:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Australia-Collection-10-Kangaroo- ... 7675.l2557

It looked a nice variety so I put in a substantial bid for it. However, clearly a number of people also saw the variety as it went for £720. Can one of the experts please let me know whether this was a known variety and what it may be worth.

Many thanks

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by josto »

Hi!

This variety is listed in ACSC as a double print. The Croxton postmark is also mentioned, so I'm quite sure this is the real deal! Cat. value for a used single is 4000$AU, so the pair has a cat. value of 8000$AU. It sold for about 1350$AU, surely not too high I think!

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by The Pom »

I was one of the underbidders as well. :cry:

It's a known & listed variety, CV $4000 per stamp. All known examples are perf OS.

This is the picture from the listing. The seller had no idea they were selling a rarity, so must have been quite surprised by the result.

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by GB 789 »

Thank you both for the information. I thought it must be something special. Amazing what finds are still out there after all these years!!!

If there is one good example for why having a clear photo on an eBay listing is important it must be this one. If it was fuzzy, the seller would have been lucky to get £10 for it rather than £720!

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by mobbor »

mobbor wrote:I don't collect roos, but have been given '000s of 1d reds to check. Which is the best checklist to buy?
The stamps were badly curled and when I checked there more KGV heads than roos. So I can't afford to buy the checklist...……..
then I found this:-

Image

Not much on the front-

Image

Missing corner. No idea what it's worth, but maybe I can afford to buy the checklist & when finished donate it to my local club.
mobbor

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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Kainnikanada »

mobbor,

How did you rotate the watermark and not the rest of the stamp?

Regardless, it's a nice find! I thought you once stated your eyesight was failing. So its excellent when necessary?
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by mobbor »

Thanks Rod, I think. The story about my eyesight is not altogether fake news. I'm short and long sighted and have cataracts. But when you've been doing it for 30 and have a magnifying glass you're used to, it's not too hard. (I'm trying to convince Ubobo that if he can see difficult postmarks from the other side of the room, he can also see plate flaws.)

It looks like the these stamps have never been properly checked. Something else coming...…...
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

I look forward to seeing the difficult postmarks. :)
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by mobbor »

I went and borrowed the BW catalogue as I know virtually nothing about these. I found something immediately:-

Image

Coloured flaw off coast of Sydney. BW 1(1)f. Supposedly 1R40.

This is the right-hand stamp of a pair. There is a top marginal watermark line, and as you can see, a right jubilee line. So it should be No. 6.(???)

Edit: Ubobo, that was quick. Don't tell me you can't see this flaw.
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Kainnikanada
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Kainnikanada »

mobbor,

Perhaps 1R40 is the incorrect plating of the ½d flaw! No mention of substitutions per se. Cliche 40 is in the same row as 42!

I don't recall any published ½d Roo flaw checklists in either the ACCCNSW or BSAP Bulletins since ca. 1986.
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mobbor
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by mobbor »

I doubt whether it will help, but here's the stamp to the left of 1(1)f


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satsuma
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by satsuma »

Kainnikanada wrote:mobbor,

Perhaps 1R40 is the incorrect plating of the ½d flaw! No mention of substitutions per se. Cliche 40 is in the same row as 42!

I don't recall any published ½d Roo flaw checklists in either the ACCCNSW or BSAP Bulletins since ca. 1986.

If this has been plated incorrectly it's been wrong since at least 1988.

My ancient copy has 1R40, too.

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Allanswood
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Re: Flaws on Aust Kangaroo stamps? Help from the experts ple

Post by Allanswood »

mobbor wrote:
mobbor wrote:

Missing corner. No idea what it's worth, but maybe I can afford to buy the checklist & when finished donate it to my local club.

I think you'll find that the corner is not missing, just folded over - so there goes you eyes again! :lol:
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