Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

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Britcollector
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Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by Britcollector »

This cancel on a 1d red SG 43-44 has me stumped.

It appears to be "D27" which I have not found. I know the stamp is in poor condition, but I am still curious. Any help appreciated.

Thanks

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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by Stan »

Concerning the post mark/cancel D27.
I have a list which I downloaded from the net that is not to hand, so I cannot at this time direct you to it.
I do have some notes I took from another source and they indicate that D27 was one listed under, Special Cancels of (British) Stamps used abroad.
My note simply indicates D27/28/29/30 where for use in China.
There is a mass of information on the subject of the use of British stamps used abroad available on the internet, I suggest you begin there if you intend to follow up on the subject. Stan

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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by goof »

Hi Britcollector

As Stan says the D27 was the cancellation for Amoy, China, I have just done a bit of a search through some literature and the examples I can see do not quite resemble yours.

The oval is horizontal in the examples I can see rather than upright, someone with access to John Parmenter's book may be able to help.

regards
Mick

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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by Britcollector »

Thanks for the pointer, Stan.

If the Internet is to be believed, that cancel, D27, was used in Amoy from 1876-1885. I have reference covering such cancels so I would appreciate your thought on:

Given the condition of this stamp, does the stamp + cancel have any value beyond curiosity?

Thanks

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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by nigelc »

The D27 postmark used at Amoy was the horizontal oval type unlike this one. It also had three bars at the bottom rather than four.
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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by Britcollector »

Thanks,

I meant to say above "I have NO reference .... "

What do the 4 bars imply? .. anyone?

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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by Stan »

Such cancelations are much sort after by the avid collectors.

I would guess that in the present climate of all things pertaining to China, antiques and the like, being much sort by Chines collectors, stamps will also be at a premium.

I still haven't located the information I downloaded on the subject but there was a great deal of it.

I do recall however that the internal postage of Great Britain also used letter prefixes, some times of necessity in a *stop gap* way or perhaps in addition to the normal cancels.

There are several on line groups/clubs who specialise and all have, as it were, done the hard yards.

So, as they say, let your fingers do the finding, on the net.
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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by norvic »

Stan wrote: I do recall however that the internal postage of Great Britain also used letter prefixes, some times of necessity in a *stop gap* way or perhaps in addition to the normal cancels.
This is nonsense. The full range of numbers used in England and Wales is (not all numbers were used)
1 -999
001-099
A16-A99
B03-B99
C01-C99
D01-D98
E01-E99
F01-F94
G01-G99
H01-H99
J01-J99
K01-K95

They were used simply because there were so many post offices that 1-999 was insufficient! Some of the numbers were allocated to overseas post offices.
Stan wrote:So, as they say, let your fingers do the finding, on the net.
I do believe that that is what Britcollector is doing by asking us here :roll: :!:
And some of the information provided is accurate and recorded in the definitive handbooks* on the subject, which some of us know just where to put our hands on.

* British Post Office Numbers 1844-1906 G Brumell, pub Alcock 1946
Collect British Postmarks, T Whitney; 8th Edition updated B Pipe, pub SG 2011
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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by rossi »

My guess is that your D27 is that one used at London:

Image

(Picture taken from the book Barred Numeral Cancellations of London by John Parmenter, 1999)
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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by norvic »

That certainly looks probable - I wonder why that is listed in neither of the books I cited?
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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by goof »

goof wrote:The oval is horizontal in the examples I can see rather than upright, someone with access to John Parmenter's book may be able to help.
Andrea

Is this a cancel for bulk mail only? Surprised its only £5 on stamp given that they are certainly not common.

regards
Mick

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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by norvic »

rossi wrote:My guess is that your D27 is that one used at London:

Image

(Picture taken from the book Barred Numeral Cancellations of London by John Parmenter, 1999)
Was this a Duplex ? I'm confused by the 'dated/undated' .
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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by rossi »

Mick and Ian, very interesting questions.

The cancellation was not a Duplex.

This page from the book should be of some help:

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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by norvic »

So, can you suggest a reason why this is not in either of the widely available and popular books on numeral postmarks previously mentioned?
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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by rossi »

I took a look here, https://www.gbps.org.uk/information/po-numbers/provincial2.php, and found written:

D27 to D56 London, Chief Office ()

so then I went to Parmenter's book and found it.

I don't own the 1946 edition of Brumell's book but on my re-print edition of 1971 I've found this at page 60:

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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by norvic »

Ah - that is also in the 1946 edition. Unfortunately D27 is on one page and D33 onwards are overleaf, where the note is. I've added 'PTO' on my page 59 - sacrilege is as it is to write in books.
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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by Britcollector »

Thank you, Gentlemen,

It seems that it could be a London Chief Office, or Inland Branch bulk mail, or a traveling post office?

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Re: Help with Cancel on GB QV 1d SG 43-44

Post by carysee »

Amoy is used as 3HOS (normally used on Hong Kong stamps though it is still rare cancellation)
London News is used as 4VOS
(Please see attached)

Cary C
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D27 3HOS and 4VOS.jpg

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