Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover chat!

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by Rod Perry »

Peter (PeterS)

I just read a little further back on this thread, and note your reference to a solo 5/- Bridge on parcel "tag" (actually a Parcels Post label).

There were two offered in the one auction earlier this year; one bought by another auctioneer and subsequently reoffered.

I rarely utter "wow" when I peruse an auction catalogue, but I did it when I saw these labels, and in the one sale. Prior to that event I knew of only one 5/- Bridge on a Parcel Post label (I have not seen an intact commercial cover or tag).

Cold water was rapidly thrown on me, however, when I noted the edition year of the P.O. labels . . . "1962".

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by Didge »

Rod,

Oops. That is not good. I would love to get an original one.

Tim

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by PeterS »

Rod Perry wrote:Peter (PeterS)

I just read a little further back on this thread, and note your reference to a solo 5/- Bridge on parcel "tag" (actually a Parcels Post label).

There were two offered in the one auction earlier this year; one bought by another auctioneer and subsequently reoffered.

I rarely utter "wow" when I peruse an auction catalogue, but I did it when I saw these labels, and in the one sale. Prior to that event I knew of only one 5/- Bridge on a Parcel Post label (I have not seen an intact commercial cover or tag).

Cold water was rapidly thrown on me, however, when I noted the edition year of the P.O. labels . . . "1962".

Rod
Ahh! So, just maybe philatelically inspired? If not ouright forgeries?
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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by Rod Perry »

Shall we say "enhancement", Peter, of what appear to be whiter than white stamps affixed?

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by Allanswood »

Looks like I just got this one at the Philatelics SA Auction today...

I know its damaged with a small tear, but for $90 all up for commercial/postal usage I'm fine with that. Its my first 5/- Bridge.

Tarraville or Yarraville CDS.

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by Global Administrator »

Greg the thin is very heavy at top, and as you can see in scan, the paper is now only tissue thickness.

Can't see where the tear is - in that area or somewhere else?

But a cheap enough space-filler.

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by BigSaint »

Gentlemen,

Postal usage on fdc is my preference
Image
From last count I think 6 are known with two of those postmarked in Sydney.

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by Didge »

Brad

Nice mate

Tim

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by Global Administrator »

BigSaint wrote:Gentlemen,

Postal usage on fdc is my preference
Image
From last count I think 6 are known with two of those postmarked in Sydney.

Brad :)
Superb item Brad. :mrgreen:

Funny how things work out, but I was just messing around on my desk looking for something else and found this cover I'd last started a thread on over 3 years back.
Image
100% Guaranteed to be in the same handwriting as your cover. See the identical style of "Mr" he uses etc.

The green cancel is clearly 1922 - not 1932.

Appears to be a unique or at least un-recorded strike -
Image
I looked this cover up in Clarrie Peck's Pictor Marks which lists and prices all such things -- not a mention. (They do list the "reserve" 1932 Bridge cancel "1" at $1,500.)

That rather surprised me, so I went into the even more dis-organised bowels of my library, and found the superb and sought after Richard Peck handbook on the Harbour Bridge stamps - and that contains EVERYTHING philatelic related to them.

Richard had several ANPEX covers and cancels illustrated, but all clearly 1932 - and no mention of any date errors.

So I then went to Prestige Auctions Maurice Williams "BRIDGE" auction. Australia Post Chairman Maurie Williams owned EVERYTHING philatelic to do with the Bridge opening week. And I mean the LOT, as you can see on link below.
,
It sold for a fortune.

These are his ANPEX Exhibition covers, and as can readily be seen, the square green cancels are clearly dated 1932.

https://www.stampboards.com/images/prestigephilately/viewpic. ... 36&lot=137

So new and highly visible new discoveries can turn up - even 80 years on! Well I am assuming it is a new discovery - has anyone seen or heard of this before?

Will pop it up on my Rarity page this week for $A150 - before I lose it yet again. :lol:

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by BigSaint »

Glen

You can sell it to me now for that & save yourself the trouble of forgetting.

Regards

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by BigSaint »

Yes, I understand Mr Ashford-Spreat was a big collector at the time. Probably why he did the first day while many others preferred to use their 5/- Bridge on opening day covers from NE & SE Pylons.

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by Global Administrator »

Brad OK .. will make a very neat pair alongside the FDC. :)

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by BigSaint »

Image

On the date stamp error, bet someone put date slugs in reverse. Instead of 23 Mar 22, probably supposed to be 22 Mar 32.

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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by BigSaint »

With 5/- Bridges on FDC, one has to be careful. This one (not in my collection) has been, I believe altered & the 5/- value added in more recent times. I have seen it several times at auctions with it's selling price reduced each time.
Image
Below is what I believe cover would have looked like.
Image
The positioning of the postmarks in 1st cover allowing alteration
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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by BigSaint »

The 5/- Bridge had no specific rate, as stated before, it's general use was for parcels & telegrams. Some considered it to be a souvenir & additionally because of the depression those who could afford to buy the stamp used that stamp on covers associated with the opening of the bridge 19th March 1932. Temporary Post Offices were set up on the North East & South East Pylons of the Bridge. The North East Pylon PO closed on 2nd April 1932.
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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by BigSaint »

The South East Pylon PO also closed on 2nd April 1932, but was re-opened in 1934 & closed again in 1941. However the South East Pylon is still being used as a viewing deck for visitors to the Bridge.
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Re: 1932 5/- Bridge with parcel post mark preferrable to CTO

Post by BigSaint »

Another SE Pylon cover with what I believe is a "Newsagents" cachet. the identity of whom is a mystery.
Image
Whilst the cachet says first day cover, it not. It is an opening day cover & when buying such a cover one should not be confused between the two. First day is March 14 & Opening day is March 19. While some say the $ value is the same, it is not.

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover d

Post by BigSaint »

72800 5/- bridge stamps were printed in sheets of 20 (4 rows of 5)

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover d

Post by Global Administrator »

I've just spend the past half hour merging a number of separate Bridge threads into one, so they are all in 1 place.

These go back to more than 5 years ago when the board was started.

Please bear with me until that is done and tidied up. :)

In the meantime read some of the older posts I have dug up!

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover d

Post by BigSaint »

Purple cancel?
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover d

Post by Global Administrator »

BigSaint wrote:
72800 5/- Bridge stamps were printed in sheets of 20 (4 rows of 5)

:)

This sheet was auctioned in October from the Hardy Collection by Phoenix. Invoice price about $A28,000.
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover d

Post by BigSaint »

Pity this is not on 5/- Bridge, but only red & green cancels are recorded from 5th Aust Philatelic Exhibition. This is clearly neither.
Image
Nor is this one!
Image
But at least it has Bridge stamps on it!

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Lakatoi 4 »

Here are three of mine:

Cancelled on 19th. March (air mail cancel on rear):
Image

Cancelled 21st. March
Image

Cancelled 22nd. March
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Lakatoi 4 »

As in my 19th. March cover above, this slogan cancel done by the same date canceller has the same defective "9" and bottom part of "Mar" in the date.

The 21st. and 22nd. dates don't have that problem:

Image

Image
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by luke_coolhand »

I've upgraded from a parcel cancel to this one of which I can only make out "32" at the end. Can anyone help with the date?
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by GlenStephens »

Luke that is a really faded washed out scan, so hard to see the cancel date -- can you darken it a bit?

==========
Image
Added this very battle scarred survivor to stock today. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Has a "Parcels Post Brisbane" cancel, only one I have seen with that cancel .. near all commercial used I've seen (and they are by no means commonly seen) are from Vic and NSW.

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Global Administrator »

Listed these 3 up for $45 yesterday, and they sold within the hour.

Photos added here for the record. :mrgreen:

The "Sydney Harbour Bridge S.E.Pylon" Registered label is not all that common, and the postcard I've not seen before, and was in pristine shape.
Image

Image

Image

Image

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Phoenix Auctions »

Thought you might be interested in this item from our next auction.
Lot 1761 2d, 3d and 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge blocks of 4 tied to separate long envelopes.

Image

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by PeterS »

Philatelic, but very unusual!
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1932 Sydney Harbour Bridge, Registered cover numbers?

Post by Bond1955 »

The highest numbered R6 labels I've seen on Registered covers are:

SE Pylon - 1439 - 29 March
NE Pylon - 646 - 21 March

Based on these numbers, you could estimate the number of covers registered at 1500 and 1000 for SE and NE respectively.

Does anyone have higher numbers?

This would be a nice cover, but for the general toning and still sold for $55 recently.

A plain cover with all four Harbour Bridge stamps (Reg no. 7, 19 March) sold for $1500.

Image
Last edited by Wayne1951 on 25 Jul 2017 11:12, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Amended the heading into a question

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Re: 1932 Sydney Harbour Bridge - Registered covers

Post by BigSaint »

For North East Pylon, I have:

464
612

For South East Pylon, I have:

48
61
1077

OZ Pictormarks may give the numbers of registered items, I will check when I go home.

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Global Administrator »

BigSaint wrote:For North East Pylon, I have:

464
612

For South East Pylon, I have:

48
61
1077

OZ Pictormarks may give the numbers of registered items, I will check when I go home.

Brad :)

Remember each PO pad of Registered labels was 1000 or 2000, then a new pad starting #0001 was used.

So several #1 might exist etc from same PO on same day even.
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by BigSaint »

Image

A recent acquisition of mine hand painted by E G McCann from opening day on the S. E. Pylon. Pity about the toning.

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by ewen s »

Are you going to try and clean it up some Brad? I wouldn't know if much can be done but would enjoy seeing it step-by-step in a thread.

Another great cover Brad 8)

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Global Administrator »

Ewen .... will be hand painted in watercolor.

ANYTHING done to it (short of an art restorer at $1000!) will make it worse I'd suggest.
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by BigSaint »

Ewen

I agree with Glen. I will leave it alone in case playing with it makes it worse.

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by ewen s »

That all makes sense and it can still be appreciated how it is. Do you know how many the artist painted Brad/Glen, and have you seen another?

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Rod Perry »

I find it interesting, and telling, that in the more than six years since this thread commenced, and with 5380 Views (at time of pumping these keys), not a single example (or multiple) of a 5/- Bridge commercially used on intact postal article has emerged?

Does anyone have an example? Can anyone show an example offered elsewhere? I'd love to see it. Forget those contrived 5/- solo frankings on 1962 edition Post Office Parcel Post labels offered at auction recently.

The only example commercially used on intact postal article I've noted thus far was a Post Office Parcel Post label offered in my Sale 146 (6 Dec 1990 – which realized $550 + 10%). My Top of the Class award to that astute buyer (sadly I no longer have those old records). Perhaps it was a Stampboards member?

Items such as this I regard as true Aristocrats of Philately; head and shoulders above in terms of philatelic importance compared with, say, the 5/- CTO.

That readily available item represents no challenge to collectors, and in real terms is far cheaper today than it was 30 or more years ago. The late Phil Downie had over 400 CTO in stock in the late 1970s, and sold them in to the Great Boom We Had to Have, for an average $400 each. That's well over a grand in today's money.

What would the commercially used example on intact Parcel Post label I had in 1990 now be worth?

I'd suggest close to 10 grand.

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Global Administrator »

You are right Rod, that on any kind of mailing piece other than Bridge covers, the 5/- really are scarce.

I bought a really lovely SON 1932 dated BALLARAT cds single this week, as it was where I was born ... along with Gary Watson, owner of Prestige, Andy and Richard Juzwin and Steward Wright of Status .. weird as that may sound!

ANY 5/- Bridge with a nice dated cds is 100 times scarcer than CTO, and indeed many of the few postally used existing have the ugly Parcel Office cancels.

I have a commercial parcel fragment laying on my desk somewhere, with a Bridge and some kind of Roos on it, but apart from that agree they are seldom seen.

Glen
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Rod Perry »

"seldom seen", in the instance of intact commercial postal articles bearing a 5/- Bridge, appears uncharacteristically conservative for you, Glen.

As mentioned two posts above, I've seen just one such item in my long philatelic career.

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by BigSaint »

ewen s wrote:That all makes sense and it can still be appreciated how it is. Do you know how many the artist painted Brad/Glen, and have you seen another?
No & no, maybe another Stampboarder has seen one?

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by markrm »

This is commercially used in the period:
Image

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Rod Perry »

Postally used in period, and so attractive (to my eye, at least) are very desirable items, a hundred times more so than a CTO clone.

Similarly, in this opinion if that of no other, an attractive intact, commercial postal article bearing the 5/- would be many multiples more desirable again.

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Re: 1932 Sydney Harbour Bridge, Registered cover numbers?

Post by BigSaint »

Bond1955 wrote:The highest numbered R6 labels I've seen on Registered covers are:

SE Pylon - 1439 - 29 March
NE Pylon - 646 - 21 March

Based on these numbers, you could estimate the number of covers registered at 1500 and 1000 for SE and NE respectively.

Does anyone have higher numbers?

This would be a nice cover, but for the general toning and still sold for $55 recently.

A plain cover with all four Harbour Bridge stamps (Reg no. 7, 19 March) sold for $1500.

Image
OZ Pictormarks says there were about 1400 registered items on opening day but does not record the two pylons separately. It is not known how many registered items were sent on the other days.

Perhaps your estimates may be a little light?

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by chrisb »

I just purchased a used 5/- with the NE Pylon Postmark dated the 22nd.

Am surprised that a person would go out of their way to get the franking and then take the stamp off the envelope.

Does anybody know whether or not the bridge post offices were used for normal post.

Chris ( PE South Africa)

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by BigSaint »

Chris

I am intrigued by your use of the wording "normal post", as I am not sure exactly what you mean.

However if you look back through this thread I think you will find the answer you are looking for.

Brad :)
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by fromdownunder »

BigSaint wrote:Chris

I am intrigued by your use of the wording "normal post", as I am not sure exactly what you mean.

Brad :)
Brad, my take on this was that were the short term "Bridge" Post Offices used to actually post mail or were they simply touristy thingies to obtain currency for the then PMG?

Norm
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by fromdownunder »

Just saw this one on eBay for starting price of AUD 1,950.

Image

Image

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1932-5-Bridge-Opening-Cover-V-Fin ... 1c3e27204a

I chased up internet references for the receiver and only found this:

https://www.ro-klinger.de/NH/1-phniko.htm

Norm
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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by BigSaint »

Norm

That "Nikoletich" cover has been up for sale for a "few" years.

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Re: Australia 1932 5/- Sydney Harbour Bridge stamp & cover c

Post by Global Administrator »

BigSaint wrote:Norm

That "Nikoletich" cover has been up for sale for a "few" years.

Brad :)
And at $US1950 ($A2100) it will be there for a few more years still. :mrgreen:

At a few bucks a time fixed price listing fee, ebay will end up making more out of it, than the seller does. :lol:

These clueless dreamers always 'FORGET' those ever present fees when you list fixed price. :idea:

Glen

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