Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2016

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by locakart »

Somerset wrote:
locakart wrote:
ViccyVFU wrote:
locakart wrote:How utterly pathetic you are in your chortling.
In terms of sentiment, I feel the much same about you ....

"How utterly pathetic you are in your incessant wimpering".

You lost. Get over it.

Then at least you won't be a sore loser .... just a loser!!
Still on with the "We won, suck it up loser" message yet again, I see. I thought that you were supposed to be calling for us all to pull together now?

You sound much more like a sore winner than I do a sore loser. I wonder why? Maybe you still haven't found a tangible, quantifiable benefit of Brexit yet? Maybe you found out that the 20 million for the NHS was just another lie?

Maybe you actually believe the crap you spouted in an earlier post about the Fourth Reich, in which case you really are beyond any rational discussion.

I'm not whimpering. I'm very annoyed that my grandkids' chances of enjoying an education and a job such as I have had have been torpedoed by ideological idiots and xenophobic economic illiterates.
The only reason your grandchildren have any sort of future is because of the sacrifice made by my grandparents generation
And also by my grandparents' generation of course.

When there was no such thing as the EU. So whose grandparents sacrificed more or less or the same as each other is totally irrelevant.
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by emason »

MarkM wrote:Is this the beach that Top Gear used to do the odd car test segment on?
I think that was Pendine Sands in Wales.
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Waffle »

This thread has sadly degenerated into mutual name calling and vituperative recrimination. Can we not be so petty, try to develop some respect for each others opinion (admittedly divided) and get on with the important things in life eg stamp collecting.For goodness sake, the referendum is long over, the 31/1/20 is past and history's page has been written. I, for one, am totally fed up by the whole event and if I never heard another thing about the whole sorry process/schemozzle, I would not shed a tear.
I prefer to collect UK, British Commonwealth esp Pacific area ( not excluding West Indies/Canada ) and Western Europe. At the bottom of my zone of interest is Eastern Europe and communist countries.

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by MarkM »

emason wrote:
MarkM wrote:Is this the beach that Top Gear used to do the odd car test segment on?
I think that was Pendine Sands in Wales.
Ok thanks.

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by gavin-h »

drh wrote:We can have a socialist government, something prohibited by the EU.
I don't think it is "prohibited by the EU" so much as "unwanted by the British electorate". :idea:

Corbyn and his Islington Intellectuals on the Labour left produced a socialist manifesto which was rejected by the electorate at a General Election less than two months ago.

They are now going through a (another!) bout of navel-gazing before preparing to unleash a new leader on us after, presumably concluding as they have for the last 4 elections that the reason they lost was "We wuz not left-wing enough".

I look forward to Rebecca Long-Bailey discovering for herself that the British electorate still don't want that kind of socialism in 4½ years time at the next General Election even though the ever-contracting clique who control the Labour Party keep moving further that way.

Long may it continue while we keep electing Conservative governments. :idea:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by norvic »

emason wrote:
collectordave wrote:Why not start a list of all the tangible benefits of the British retreat from Europe? Then all can see how the British people have benefited form brexit.

A benefit being something good we have now which we could not have while a member of the EU.

I would start the list but at the moment I cannot think of any tangible benefit.

Does anyone have one?
I do.

1. Restoration of full Sovereignty.

2. Democratic election of our leaders.
(Not the EU system where a single candidate no-one has heard of is put up.)

All benefits stem from those two.
Those are not tangible benefits, you have to say what they mean and what the actual tangible benefit is.
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by OldDuffer1 »

norvic wrote: Those are not tangible benefits, you have to say what they mean and what the actual tangible benefit is.
Only time will tell but we are out now so no point "beating the breast" about it!

There will obviously be advantages and disadvantages as with any change. At least policies will be decided by people directly accountable to ourselves.

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by norvic »

OldDuffer1 wrote:
norvic wrote: Those are not tangible benefits, you have to say what they mean and what the actual tangible benefit is.
Only time will tell but we are out now so no point "beating the breast" about it!

There will obviously be advantages and disadvantages as with any change. At least policies will be decided by people directly accountable to ourselves.
I'm not beating the breast, just pointing out that "Restoration of full Sovereignty" is a vaccuous term when what was asked for were tangible benefits.

As for Democratic election of our leaders... for a certain type of democracy we have had that for a long time. And for those suggesting an alternative system I refer the members to reports of the Irish General Election 'result'.
About 100 of the 160 seats have been declared, but negotiations to establish a government could be prolonged.

On Sunday evening, taoiseach (Irish PM) and Fine Gael leader Leo Varadkar conceded it would be "challenging" to form a government.
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

norvic wrote: As for Democratic election of our leaders... for a certain type of democracy we have had that for a long time. And for those suggesting an alternative system I refer the members to reports of the Irish General Election 'result'.
About 100 of the 160 seats have been declared, but negotiations to establish a government could be prolonged.

On Sunday evening, taoiseach (Irish PM) and Fine Gael leader Leo Varadkar conceded it would be "challenging" to form a government.
Leo won't be Taoiseach, that will fall to Micheál Martin of Fianna Fáil. Probably a coalition of FF, Greens and some others, with a confidence and supply agreement with Leo's Fine Gael.

Coalition governments are the norm here, as in pretty much all of Europe.

The British first past the post takes all, is a somewhat archaic system.

However, if Micheál goes in with Sinn Féin........expect a Northern Ireland border poll to become official policy........in Brexit negotiations.

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by emason »

norvic wrote:
emason wrote:
collectordave wrote:Why not start a list of all the tangible benefits of the British retreat from Europe? Then all can see how the British people have benefited form brexit.

A benefit being something good we have now which we could not have while a member of the EU.

I would start the list but at the moment I cannot think of any tangible benefit.

Does anyone have one?
I do.

1. Restoration of full Sovereignty.

2. Democratic election of our leaders.
(Not the EU system where a single candidate no-one has heard of is put up.)

All benefits stem from those two.
Those are not tangible benefits, you have to say what they mean and what the actual tangible benefit is.
Oh yes they are; and no I don't!

Without wishing to get into an argument about semantics, here are some
definitions of 'tangible' from various dictionaries:
1. capable on being perceived especially by the sense of touch, palpable
2. substantialy real, material.
3. able to be shown and not imaginary.
4. real or actual, rather than imaginary or visionary:
5. capable of being precisely identified or realized by the mind
6. something that can be understood.

Synonyms:
definite, real, positive, material, actual, palpable, appreciable, perceptible.

To me, both 'sovereignty' and 'democracy' are 'substantialy real'; 'not imaginary'; 'capable of being realized by the mind'; and 'something that can be understood'. They are also 'real', appreciable' and 'perceptible'.

If, as I suspect, the purpose of the OP was show that there are no 'tangible' benefits using the narrow defininition: 'capable of being perceived especially by the sense of touch', then I would agree - unless the Treasury allow you to get your hands on the umpteen billions we won't be paying into the EU's coffers. :)
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by locakart »

emason wrote:
collectordave wrote:Why not start a list of all the tangible benefits of the British retreat from Europe? Then all can see how the British people have benefited form brexit.

A benefit being something good we have now which we could not have while a member of the EU.

I would start the list but at the moment I cannot think of any tangible benefit.

Does anyone have one?
I do.

1. Restoration of full Sovereignty.

2. Democratic election of our leaders.
(Not the EU system where a single candidate no-one has heard of is put up.)

All benefits stem from those two.
So Brexit will bring us democratic election of our leaders? I do trust that you will therefore be demanding the immediate abolition of the monarchy and the immediate abolition of the House of Lords.

After all, they don't even have candidates you can vote for - they just get appointed by birth or by the whim of the politicians you hate so much.

Or will you start with the semantics again to wriggle out of the corner you seem determined to paint yourself into?
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by emason »

locakart wrote:So Brexit will bring us democratic election of our leaders? I do trust that you will therefore be demanding the immediate abolition of the monarchy and the immediate abolition of the House of Lords.
Then your trust is misplaced. For your information, our democratically elected leaders are the Members of Parliament - not the Monarchy nor the House of Lords which is only advisory.
locakart wrote:After all, they don't even have candidates you can vote for - they just get appointed by birth or by the whim of the politicians you hate so much.
I have never expressed hatred for politicians. It seems all the hate is coming from you.
locakart wrote:Or will you start with the semantics again to wriggle out of the corner you seem determined to paint yourself into?
What a vivid imagination you have!

There have been several recent appeals for this thread to be a civil and respectful exchange of views. I suggest you heed these.

Until you can post a reply relevant to the subject matter which is not full of taunts, falsehoods and personal invective, I shall not be responding to you again.
Best wishes,
Bill

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Somerset »

locakart wrote:
emason wrote:
collectordave wrote:Why not start a list of all the tangible benefits of the British retreat from Europe? Then all can see how the British people have benefited form brexit.

A benefit being something good we have now which we could not have while a member of the EU.

I would start the list but at the moment I cannot think of any tangible benefit.

Does anyone have one?
I do.

1. Restoration of full Sovereignty.

2. Democratic election of our leaders.
(Not the EU system where a single candidate no-one has heard of is put up.)

All benefits stem from those two.
So Brexit will bring us democratic election of our leaders? I do trust that you will therefore be demanding the immediate abolition of the monarchy and the immediate abolition of the House of Lords.

After all, they don't even have candidates you can vote for - they just get appointed by birth or by the whim of the politicians you hate so much.

Or will you start with the semantics again to wriggle out of the corner you seem determined to paint yourself into?
Our political leaders, the people who make the decisions, are the MPs. The Lords are only able to force delay and the Monarch is a political figurehead.

You seem unconcerned with national soveriegnty - that is fair enough. I think it is one of those concepts which is either important to you or not.

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by norvic »

Those are not tangible benefits, you have to say what they mean and what the actual tangible benefit is.
Oh yes they are; and no I don't!

Without wishing to get into an argument about semantics, here are some
definitions of 'tangible' from various dictionaries:
1. capable on being perceived especially by the sense of touch, palpable
2. substantialy real, material.
3. able to be shown and not imaginary.
4. real or actual, rather than imaginary or visionary:
5. capable of being precisely identified or realized by the mind
6. something that can be understood.

Synonyms:
definite, real, positive, material, actual, palpable, appreciable, perceptible.

To me, both 'sovereignty' and 'democracy' are 'substantialy real'; 'not imaginary'; 'capable of being realized by the mind'; and 'something that can be understood'. They are also 'real', appreciable' and 'perceptible'.
If, as I suspect, the purpose of the OP was show that there are no 'tangible' benefits using the narrow defininition: 'capable of being perceived especially by the sense of touch', then I would agree - unless the Treasury allow you to get your hands on the umpteen billions we won't be paying into the EU's coffers. :)
I accept your distinction. However, my response was related to what I suspect and you suspect the OPs purpose was. I'd be interested in your definition of 'full Sovereignty'.

If (as wikipedia suggests) you mean
"Sovereignty is the full right and power of a governing body over itself, without any interference from outside sources or bodies. "
... then I can see where you are going. But if you join a 'club' or 'association' and have delegates who are involved in the decision-making process of that organisation, then I would argue that that would not count as 'interference from outside sources or bodies'.

But I think I can see what you are getting at. Perhaps you could, nonetheless, find some 'tangible' benefits by the narrower definition?
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by satsuma »

It seems to me that the most tangible benefit is being able to create independent legislation on immigration, residence and visitation.

I presume parliament has that as a high priority.

Whether the citizens of the UK like any changes that are promulgated is another matter.

For example, one position I have seen posited is to mirror the national legislation of the applicant as it applies to their visitors.

An example of this could be:
Japan requires fingerprinting of almost all visitors on arrival. UK could make it mandatory for Japanese nationals to be fingerprinted on arrival.

It's a simple example, but easy to understand, despite the arguments it would engender.

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Global Administrator »

Well one Brexit side issue - the Irish border now seemed to be of little issue now Sinn Fein seem to have gained enormously over all the Brexit bickering taking attention away from REAL issue in Ireland, and they and their coalition partners will be talking to Boris about a United Ireland it seems.

A shame they did not field more Candidates, or they would be running the show right now it seems.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/10/sinn-fein-decl ... l-election
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by OldDuffer1 »

While true that Sinn Fein have gained it seems that domestic issues have been more important to the electorate in Ireland (such as shortage of affordable housing) than the "Unite Ireland" issue. Similarly here in Scotland a vote for the SNP does not necessarily show approval for an independent Scotland.(Although obviously both Parties will push for their agendas).

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

38 Fianna Fail, The Republican Party
37 Sinn Féin, the you know what party
35 Fine Gael, The United Ireland Party
12 Greens, The Veggie Party
38 Others
160 Total

We call the result, a Rainbow Government or a Dolly Mix, been there before :wink:

Sinn Féin's first priority is a border pole and they will probably get first "shot" at forming a government.

After SF fail, it will be FF with Greens and some others, with a confidence and supply agreement with FG.

Boris's likely failure to get his trade agreement with the EU will soon join housing shortage and health on the radar screen.

Brexit hasn't gone away, you know......... :mrgreen:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by norvic »

Cill Dara wrote:Sinn Féin's first priority is a border pole and they will probably get first "shot" at forming a government.
Will the border pole hold up the Irish flag, or the barrier to entry?
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by gavin-h »

Cill Dara wrote:We call the result, a Rainbow Government or a Dolly Mix, been there before :wink:
We call the result a Government that NOBODY Voted For, we've been there as well, 2010-15. :wink:

I'd be interested to know to what extent you think Brexit has influenced this interesting result of the Irish General Election, or not at all.

Sadly, we've had less coverage of Irish politics recently than you have had of ours, so genuinely interested in an insider's view of the issues and dynamics happening on your side of the Irish Sea.

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

norvic wrote:
Cill Dara wrote:Sinn Féin's first priority is a border pole and they will probably get first "shot" at forming a government.
Will the border pole hold up the Irish flag, or the barrier to entry?
:lol: :lol: :lol:

The Irish flag flies on both sides of the non-border.........much of NI is British in name only. :wink:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

gavin-h wrote:
Cill Dara wrote:We call the result, a Rainbow Government or a Dolly Mix, been there before :wink:
We call the result a Government that NOBODY Voted For, we've been there as well, 2010-15. :wink:

I'd be interested to know to what extent you think Brexit has influenced this interesting result of the Irish General Election, or not at all.

Sadly, we've had less coverage of Irish politics recently than you have had of ours, so genuinely interested in an insider's view of the issues and dynamics happening on your side of the Irish Sea.

Brexit was a non-issue in the election..........that will change later this year, when Boris has a tantrum with the EU.

Boris is ruling with a thumping majority, with 43% of the vote.

You need over 50% of the vote with our PR system to get a majority .........much fairer and more representative than your archaic system.

Boris actually has a major problem with his huge majority, in raising unreal expectations and in danger of becoming sloppy, with weakened oversight.

Irish government 10 year bond yields are still in negative territory today.........you pay us to take your money. :wink:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by gavin-h »

Cill Dara wrote:You need over 50% of the vote with our PR system to get a majority .........much fairer and more representative than your archaic system.
In some ways I agree with you about PR systems, BUT from a pragmatic point of view I much prefer our FPTP system for all its flaws.

From our (albeit limited) experience it seems to be more about keeping your coalition partners sweet and not offending them and less about getting on with the sometimes hard and unpleasant work of governing the country.

There's also a good argument to be made that coalition government is LESS democratic as a party with a small percentage of the vote holds the balance of power and can force extreme/unpopular policies through with the threat of bringing the government down if they don't support those policies.

And as I said previously, it's a government that nobody voted for. I don't know a single person who wanted a Cons-LidDem coalition before the 2010 election but I know plenty of Liberals who couldn't stand the Conservatives and vice-versa. And in 2015, the Liberal Democrats were "punished" by the electorate for jumping into bed with those pesky Tories (and have suffered again at the 2017 and 2019 elections - although to bring it back on-topic, their poor 2019 showing probably had more to do with being a "Remain" party).

How long do you expect it to take to get a formal agreement and a working government in place following your election results?

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

gavin-h wrote: How long do you expect it to take to get a formal agreement and a working government in place following your election results?
Probably a month, possibly longer.........in the meantime, Leo is minding the store.

"I agree with Nick" does ring a bell. :wink:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Somerset »

I can't see Dublin running the whole island anytime soon. Dublin can't afford the enormous sums of taxpayers money London gives NI each year.

I think Dublin is also worried about the Loyalist para - military forces. The British intelligence forces saw the UVF as the most efficient of the armed groups. Then there was a problem for the UVF - the crown forces were seen as both oppressers and friends. This would not be the case in re - united Ireland.

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by collectordave »

emason wrote:
collectordave wrote:Why not start a list of all the tangible benefits of the British retreat from Europe? Then all can see how the British people have benefited form brexit.

A benefit being something good we have now which we could not have while a member of the EU.

I would start the list but at the moment I cannot think of any tangible benefit.

Does anyone have one?
I do.

1. Restoration of full Sovereignty.

2. Democratic election of our leaders.
(Not the EU system where a single candidate no-one has heard of is put up.)

All benefits stem from those two.
The thing I am trying to get to is to have 'all the benefits that stem from those two' written down and explained surely not difficult.
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

Anyway, back on topic........

Europe’s chief Brexit negotiator has warned UK politicians not to “kid” themselves about continued access to the EU market for UK financial services firms.

Addressing the European Parliament on Tuesday, Michel Barnier told MEPs the EU would not open financial services up for negotiations in trade talks.

Instead, the EU will offer ‘equivalence’, which means European regulators will dictate the standards that UK-based finance firms must uphold


https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/michel-barnier-brexit-trad ... m_Wpa9-C3j


"EU regulators will dictate the standards"..........the rotters, the EU is taking back control Boris. :wink:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by gavin-h »

Cill Dara wrote:"EU regulators will dictate the standards"..........
We DON'T LIKE dictators.

And we ALWAYS beat them.

OK, I'll get in first with the Dad's Army reference: "They don't like it up 'em, Captain Mainwaring!"

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Somerset »

Cill Dara wrote:Anyway, back on topic........

Europe’s chief Brexit negotiator has warned UK politicians not to “kid” themselves about continued access to the EU market for UK financial services firms.

Addressing the European Parliament on Tuesday, Michel Barnier told MEPs the EU would not open financial services up for negotiations in trade talks.

Instead, the EU will offer ‘equivalence’, which means European regulators will dictate the standards that UK-based finance firms must uphold


https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/michel-barnier-brexit-trad ... m_Wpa9-C3j


"EU regulators will dictate the standards"..........the rotters, the EU is taking back control Boris. :wink:
This is the initial position, we take a very different position. Both sides will shift - it's how trade deals work.

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

gavin-h wrote:
Cill Dara wrote:"EU regulators will dictate the standards"..........
We DON'T LIKE dictators.

And we ALWAYS beat them.

OK, I'll get in first with the Dad's Army reference: "They don't like it up 'em, Captain Mainwaring!"

Your rationale is not rational and is decidedly Fawlty.

Does Single Market ring a Brexit bell?

Try that line with your bank manager. :wink:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by locakart »

emason wrote:
locakart wrote:So Brexit will bring us democratic election of our leaders? I do trust that you will therefore be demanding the immediate abolition of the monarchy and the immediate abolition of the House of Lords.
Then your trust is misplaced. For your information, our democratically elected leaders are the Members of Parliament - not the Monarchy nor the House of Lords which is only advisory.
locakart wrote:After all, they don't even have candidates you can vote for - they just get appointed by birth or by the whim of the politicians you hate so much.
I have never expressed hatred for politicians. It seems all the hate is coming from you.
locakart wrote:Or will you start with the semantics again to wriggle out of the corner you seem determined to paint yourself into?
What a vivid imagination you have!

There have been several recent appeals for this thread to be a civil and respectful exchange of views. I suggest you heed these.

Until you can post a reply relevant to the subject matter which is not full of taunts, falsehoods and personal invective, I shall not be responding to you again.
Challenging what you say is not taunting you. Asking you not to descend into semantics to avoid answering the question is not personal invective.

You made your point about the monarchy and the House of Lords. I accept your point of view on that. Your point is perfectly valid - but does tend to open up another argument about the actual purpose of the two institutions.

I did not descent into personal invective. I replied to the points you made. But now you have decided to take your bat home.

Why oh why do the propagandists of brexit get so offended so very easily if anybody dares to challenge their narrative?

You know that you are in the right. Go on then, give us just one quantifiable benefit of brexit without resorting to verbiage about the supposed lack of democracy (when the Brexit Party got elected to the EU Parliament and the UK had a veto on the regulations, hence never losing sovereignty) or the confusion about immigration rules (when each country of the EU was responsible for its own immigration rules, hence the fact that we always had sovereignty).
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by emason »

collectordave wrote:The thing I am trying to get to is to have 'all the benefits that stem from those two' written down and explained surely not difficult.
No, not difficult - just tiresome.

The pros and cons of Brexit have been exhaustively discussed ad nauseum in this thread. I have no wish to repeat again what you can read for yourself here, in the press and on the internet on the subject, surely not difficult.

You have been a member since well before the referendum was anounced on 20 Feb 2016, and so must have viewed this thread many times and read the arguments. Are you really telling us that you still don't know what many believe the benefits to be?
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by collectordave »

emason wrote:
collectordave wrote:The thing I am trying to get to is to have 'all the benefits that stem from those two' written down and explained surely not difficult.
No, not difficult - just tiresome.

The pros and cons of Brexit have been exhaustively discussed ad nauseum in this thread. I have no wish to repeat again what you can read for yourself here, in the press and on the internet on the subject, surely not difficult.

You have been a member since well before the referendum was anounced on 20 Feb 2016, and so must have viewed this thread many times and read the arguments. Are you really telling us that you still don't know what many believe the benefits to be?
I am not about to read through 67 pages although I have read quite a few. I have also followed the press and read bits on the internet.

I have as yet not found one benefit of brexit.

Would be nice just to state one of these obviously well publicised benefits as even though I am told they are extremely self evident I can still not find one not even one that people believe to be a benefit that actually is.
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by drh »

It would have been a lot quicker for E.Mason and others to simply list the benefits, even just five of them, than to write log winded posts telling people to look for them in the 67 page thread.

I voted Leave to precipitate the break up of both the EU and the UK. That's it.

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by norvic »

And what was your purpose in breaking up the UK?
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by gavin-h »

collectordave wrote:I have as yet not found one benefit of brexit.
The most obvious one is that the democratically elected Government is implementing the democratic will of the British people. :idea:

What will happen in the future is unknown and unquantifiable - that's the wonderful thing about the future!

Whether we will be better off in 10, 20, 30 years time if we left or if we remained is something for historians to debate at that time, not now. :idea:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by norvic »

gavin-h wrote:
collectordave wrote:I have as yet not found one benefit of brexit.
The most obvious one is that the democratically elected Government is implementing the democratic will of the British people. :idea:

What will happen in the future is unknown and unquantifiable - that's the wonderful thing about the future!

Whether we will be better off in 10, 20, 30 years time if we left or if we remained is something for historians to debate at that time, not now. :idea:
Yes, it's too late now, though if somebody does come up with a tangible benefit I'd really welcome a mention here.

None of the alleged benefits cited during the referendum campaign seems anywhere near likely now. Meanwhile the prime minister bumbles along - or did he really want a new Chancellor but preferred not to sack SD?

A reminder of how easy everything will be:

"The day after we vote to leave, we hold all the cards and we can choose the path we want" - Michael Gove, 9 April 2016

"The Free Trade Agreement that we will do with the EU should be one of the easiest in human history" - Liam Fox, 20 July 2016

"There will be no downside to Brexit, only a considerable upside" - David Davies 10 October 2016

Ho hum.
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

Only slightly off topic..........Javid resigns for not playing along with the Rasputin Cummings songbook.

Also, Bojo sacks NI Secretary Julian Smith.........the only competent NI Secretary since Mo Mowlam.

Carry on regardless Bojo. :wink:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

London calling, London calling.............

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Ubobo.R.O. »

Cill Dara wrote:I was offered my pick of the jobs, but decided to stick at what I do best.
If that was comedy relief you failed there as well.
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

A Brexiteer who was forced to wait in an immigration queue at an EU airport in Amsterdam has complained that "this isn’t the Brexit I voted for”.

Colin Browning, who described himself as one of the 17.4 million people who voted for Brexit, said he was forced to wait for nearly an hour at Amsterdam Airport Schiphol before his passport was checked.

Officials at Schiphol have previously warned that people travelling from the UK could expect delays upon arriving in Amsterdam after Britain's exit from the EU.


On Thursday, the UK government confirmed that tough new travel rules will come into effect next year which could mean a traveller whose British passport has almost 15 months to run may be turned away from EU airports.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-eu-ai ... 35281.html


Bloody foreigners...........Colin can always go to Bugger Bogner with his shiny new blue passport......Fabriqué en France. :wink:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by ViccyVFU »

Cill Dara wrote:A Brexiteer who was forced to wait in an immigration queue at an EU airport in Amsterdam has complained that "this isn’t the Brexit I voted for”.


Pathetic reporting. (This is most likely a Remoaner making up "a jolly jape" to tell down the pub, whilst they are "still" drowning their sorrows).

Queues at Schiphol often exceeded an hour "for non Schengen travellers" before Brexit, (and don't get me started on the lazy French, at CDG).

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by OldDuffer1 »

Cill Dara wrote: On Thursday, the UK government confirmed that tough new travel rules will come into effect next year which could mean a traveller whose British passport has almost 15 months to run may be turned away from EU airports.
If you really think that Spain and Greece are going to turn away those Brit. tourists that they depend on. Well ....

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

OldDuffer1 wrote:
If you really think that Spain and Greece are going to turn away those Brit. tourists that they depend on. Well ....
New rules will come into place next year and the UK government issued fresh guidance to Britons today.

The government announced online on Thursday: “Until 1 January 2021, you can continue to travel to Europe with your UK passport until it expires.

“New rules will apply for travel to Europe from 1 January 2021.

“You’ll need to have at least six months left on an adult or child passport to travel to most countries in Europe (not including Ireland).


https://www.express.co.uk/travel/articles/1241949/brexit-new ... 021-latest


Did you not get the memo from Rasputin Cummings?

You've been warned by HM Boris and you will be turned back at UK departure. That's the way it works. :wink:

Brexit means Brexit.......innit?

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

................Schadenfreude :mrgreen:

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by norvic »

Cill Dara wrote:................Schadenfreude :mrgreen:
Bless you!! :lol:
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by collectordave »

On Thursday, the UK government confirmed that tough new travel rules will come into effect next year which could mean a traveller whose British passport has almost 15 months to run may be turned away from EU airports.
Looking at the 'Tough New Rules' they appear to be the same rules we had before joining the EU not new or tough.

I wonder how long it will be before the UK gov announce the 'Tough New Rules' for driving your car or mobile home in the EU and the 'Tough New Rules' for health care and insurance for holidaying in the EU?
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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Global Administrator »

Image
Ran a piece on these rather cool BREXIT isolationist stamps and the near $2000 UK Brexit coins that sold out on day of issue from Royal Mint.

https://glenstephens.com/snmarch20.html

I was very surprised AUSTRIA did not reprint them, and 140,000 will not be a lot, if they are regarded as a de-facto EUROPA stamp issue. :)

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Somerset »

Cill Dara wrote:................Schadenfreude :mrgreen:
So I will need six months on my passport - think I can manage that.

The point remains - Greece is still in a terrible financial mess, so they will be doing all they can to encourage us to visit.

Once you have had a few months of rule by the army council I may not b able to visit the Free State at all

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Re: Political Consequences of Britain's BREXIT Referendum, 2

Post by Cill Dara »

Nurse.........one of them has escaped........and is displaying terminal symptoms. :lol: :lol: :lol:

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