Complete set of Cinderella Stamps Catalogues.(#1-24)A$48+P&P

Browny · Post by **Browny** » 07 Dec 2009 00:44

(July 2010 update - order these on a CD Rom for $A35 postfree on - stamps[at]stamps4collectors.net - see this thread for all details -

https://www.stampboards.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=19633- Admin

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Bill Hornadge is reknown for having owned and ran the huge Seven Seas Stamps organisation prior to the 90's.

When he sold that organisation, he started a Cinderella Stamp business to fill in his time.

The first catalogue he produced was released in 1990, and the scans following a just a few pages (out of the 24 available), from that single first edition.

Whilst the catalogue was for direct sale items, it is also a unique reference guide to the world's cinderella stamps.

1991 saw the second edition, which contained a completely different 2 dozen pages of historical background to cinderellas.

What followed from there, was nearly a decade of 24 catalogues!

These contained over 800 pages on cinderella stamps from throughout the world.

The data and history these contain is just too diverse to even attempt to list, but suffice to say there is the 'normal' type items such as Scouts, Antarctic, Hutt River, Duck Stamps, Local Posts, Airmails, World Philatelic Exhibitions, Christmas seals, TB, and Railways; right through to:
'Help lick Hitler',
NOTGELDS,
Canada strike mails,
an American ANZAC stamp(!)
Kaiser Wilhelm Silver jubilees,
Irish Sweepstakes,
WW1 Anti German propoganda labels,
Chinese Hell banknotes

And those above are only from the first 3 issues of the 24 for sale (A$48 each = only A$2 each.)

Following are some pages from the first edition only:

The total weight of these catalogues is approx 1.2 kg, so please note freight costs!

The catalogues will be packaged carefully, the sent as parcelpost to wherever required.

Postage and Packaging in Australia will be $15 - $20 depending on which state.

P & P in New Zealand / Asia will be $25 - $30 depending on locality.

Worldwide will be $36 - $44 again depending on exact location.

Please email me if interested, and I'll work out exact rate for you.

Payment via Direct debit, paypal, cheque or moneyorder ok in Australia.

Payment via Paypal if overseas.

Please ask if any questions.

Cheers.

Browny.

norvic · Post by **norvic** » 07 Dec 2009 03:11

Wanted!!! Will contact you by email.

Philanthropist · Post by **Philanthropist** » 07 Dec 2009 08:26

bummer, it just does not pay to sleep at night

Philanthropist · Post by **Philanthropist** » 07 Dec 2009 08:32

Question, what would a it cost to have these photocopied before they leave the Antipodes?

Kev · Post by **Kev** » 07 Dec 2009 08:37

Philanthropist wrote:bummer, it just does not pay to sleep at night

My computer has been on since about 6.15 AM but this offer did not arrive into my inbox until 8.28 AM.

Why is this so?

Cheers, Kev.

Stefy · Post by **Stefy** » 07 Dec 2009 10:11

Browny

Are they duplicates that you have? Will it be possible to 'borrow' them to photocopy please?

Please disregard if my question is not appropriate.

Cheers,
Stefy

Diver Pete · Post by **Diver Pete** » 07 Dec 2009 11:02

Browny,

If you do have duplicates, I would be more than happy to scan them into PDF and create a CD for the throng that would like these. In fact, if Ian is agreeable, if they are sent via Sydney, I can do it with all 48 issues. Just a thought!

Philly - I concurr!

I logged on at 0530 this morning to see that Ian had snaffled then 2 hours earlier!

Let me know if it suits all parties as there could be a win-win all around here! 8)

Browny · Post by **Browny** » 07 Dec 2009 12:11

Wanted!!! Will contact you by email.

Thanks Ian.

Email sent to your collegue.

Regarding the copying and scanning wishes, I think we better wait on a response from the purchaser regarding the delay in posting that this will incur.
I will advise him by email regarding your wishes and post a response when known.

Thanks all.
Browny.

sherro · Post by **sherro** » 07 Dec 2009 12:14

Of course, I could be a pedant, and throw the word "copyright" into the ring

Eric Casagrande · Post by **Eric Casagrande** » 07 Dec 2009 12:27

Sherro ... I didn't know you were a schoolmaster.

pedâ‹…antâ€‚â€‚/ËˆpÉ›dnt/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [ped-nt] Show IPA
Use Pedant in a Sentence
See web results for Pedant
See images of Pedant
-noun 1. a person who makes an excessive or inappropriate display of learning.
2. a person who overemphasizes rules or minor details.
3. a person who adheres rigidly to book knowledge without regard to common sense.
4. Obsolete. a schoolmaster.

Stefy · Post by **Stefy** » 07 Dec 2009 12:34

Oh Eric

Be careful, you might be striking a chord there!

Sherro,
It's purely for personal learning...

Yes, of course it all depends on the purchaser's agreement.

sherro · Post by **sherro** » 07 Dec 2009 12:58

Eric Casagrande wrote:Sherro ... I didn't know you were a schoolmaster.

pedâ‹…antâ€‚â€‚/ËˆpÉ›dnt/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [ped-nt] Show IPA
Use Pedant in a Sentence
See web results for Pedant
See images of Pedant
-noun 1. a person who makes an excessive or inappropriate display of learning.
2. a person who overemphasizes rules or minor details.
3. a person who adheres rigidly to book knowledge without regard to common sense.
4. Obsolete. a schoolmaster.

I'm probably more Number 2!

(I wouldn't mind a copy on CD myself

)

Philanthropist · Post by **Philanthropist** » 07 Dec 2009 12:59

sherro wrote:Of course, I could be a pedant, and throw the word "copyright" into the ring

Copyright

this is purely for personal research, and making a copy to ensure the safety of contents in case the original gets lost in the mail.

Besides I met Bill Hornadge at the weekend, and he said "Sure, no problems"

They were printed long ago...............

GOMC 3

Global Administrator · Post by **Global Administrator** » 07 Dec 2009 13:58

I bought a fair chunk of what was in those brochures when Bill was selling up in the last few years, and I still have cartons of it strewn around .. one carton is about 20 kilos and just has sheets of USA Xmas seals!

Another has PNG phonograph records of Bird Of Paradise calls ........... etc.

I also bought cartons of his massive Pitcairn Island wholesale stock.

Bill was quite the marketer, and taught me much of what I know now.

I first started writing stamp columns for him some 25 years back. He started 'Stamp News' 55 years back so must be well into his 80s now.

I phoned him just now and he is delighted to approve any kind of copying and distribution of these lists at no fee to him, as members see fit.

Bill is very frail now and has lost much of his eyesight sadly - hence the erratic typing on his 'invoice' below.

Assuming norvic does not mind a slight delay, this mught be a plan -

I agree having copies of them out there is a great thing, as much of what he offered is outlined in these lists and nowhere else. And boy he came up with some seriously weird stuff!

I'd sure like a copy for my library!

Frankly Bill would not care if they were sold for a nominal sum to cover the copying and postage ... he told me members could do whatever they liked in that regard - he gave his full blessing to it.

How many pages total is it Browny -- might be something a local printer can run off 50 copies of and bind as a full set as A4 with a clip at end holding them together? They were all mono as I recall so cost will not be extreme?

Or maybe someone here has access to a large copier at work with collating trays etc that can offer to do it?

Sell them at $10 or $20 a set plus post perhaps?

Brummie · Post by **Brummie** » 07 Dec 2009 14:12

That is really nice of Bill Hornadge agreeing to copying his work. That is all that is needed to copy them, otherwise it would be only one copy without breaking any copyright laws.

Now it is up to the owner, Browny to agree to copies being made. What say you, Browny?

Diver Pete · Post by **Diver Pete** » 07 Dec 2009 14:37

Very generous of Bill! 8)

My offer still stands to scan these in as seperate PDF documents and then compile onto a CD.

Once I get an idea of how many are required, I could formulate an idea of costs. I would donate my time for the scanning and creating the CD but would charge for CD and distribution. I have access to a high volume scanner for these purposes.

I think it would be much more portable in CD format rather than 1.2kg of paper!

[I was wondering what I was going to do over the Christmas break given that 12 months ago I spent days editing threads for the migration across tothe new server...

]

Over to the vendor and purchaser for their descision. 8)

Stefy · Post by **Stefy** » 07 Dec 2009 15:31

A CD or an emailed pdf file will do just fine.

LOL - funny how discussions flared on this board!

erich · Post by **erich** » 07 Dec 2009 16:27

I would like a CD or PDF if one is produced. I saw a few items on the examples from his lists that I've found in collections and said to myself "oh, THAT's what that is!" ... it would be a good reference.

Kev · Post by **Kev** » 07 Dec 2009 16:48

Count me in too please.

Cheers, Kev.

Browny · Post by **Browny** » 07 Dec 2009 17:10

G'day all!

To throw a curveball into this equation, it is not myself that owns them. They were a gift to our local Philatelic Society, and as President it fell into my lap to obtain a fair price for them. (Along with the Pineapple Post catalogue). I am sure no-one at the club would mind a delay in the monies to be forthcoming, however that still remains to be discussed with the purchaser.

I am sure a win-win solution can be arrived at somehow.

He started 'Stamp News' 55 years back so must be well into his 80s now.

From the back of one of the catalogues, I think (at work so cant tell you exactly!), Bill stated he was 81 when he stopped producing in 1999....so add a decade. It's great to have him still with us!!

How many pages total is it Browny

Most cat's were 32 pages, with a few earlier ones at 24, and the bumper last one at 96. Totals at over 800 pages.

They were all mono as I recall so cost will not be extreme?

There was a trial run of a few catalogues only with the central pages in colour. It wouldn't detract if these were cpied in B & W!

Thanks for all your responses, and I'll let you know when i've heard from Norvic's collegue.

Cheers.
Browny.

gmoney · Post by **gmoney** » 07 Dec 2009 17:25

I would be interested in CD or PDF file.

norvic · Post by **norvic** » 08 Dec 2009 03:32

Browny wrote:
Wanted!!! Will contact you by email.
Thanks Ian.
Email sent to your collegue.

Regarding the copying and scanning wishes, I think we better wait on a response from the purchaser regarding the delay in posting that this will incur.
I will advise him by email regarding your wishes and post a response when known.

Thanks all.
Browny.

Just in case he doesn't get round to looking at all the discussion here - and why would he now that he's bagged them for the price of a free phone call! - I'll mention to him that pdf/cd is being considered. We'll be at the President's Night Tuesday evening for mince pies and whatever - oh and may look at some stamps as well.

Eric Casagrande · Post by **Eric Casagrande** » 08 Dec 2009 04:40

Ian .... can you send me a slice of that mince pie?

BTW .... how long does it take to scan 800 pages (to .pdf file)? Even with two pages per scan it seems like quite the job. If I were the lucky buyer of this lot, I'd nix the idea.

Diver Pete · Post by **Diver Pete** » 08 Dec 2009 05:07

Eric Casagrande wrote:BTW .... how long does it take to scan 800 pages (to .pdf file)? Even with two pages per scan it seems like quite the job. If I were the lucky buyer of this lot, I'd nix the idea.

I have a high volume scanner (at my disposal) that would do this as fast as I can press the button! 8)

Even still, 800 pages would take the best part of a day!

mcgooley · Post by **mcgooley** » 08 Dec 2009 10:33

I'm willing to chip in for a copy of these, in ANY format.

samkelly · Post by **samkelly** » 08 Dec 2009 13:06

What is the owner's response

Sam

Eric Casagrande · Post by **Eric Casagrande** » 08 Dec 2009 13:28

I'm a little confused here ... (not the first time

).

So Norvic isn't the buyer, but asked for the items on behalf of a buyer?

Diver Pete · Post by **Diver Pete** » 08 Dec 2009 13:53

Eric Casagrande wrote:I'm a little confused here ... (not the first time ).

So Norvic isn't the buyer, but asked for the items on behalf of a buyer?

Eric, I think you have hit the nail on the head!

We could get Ian on a technicality though as he never said SOLD!

That aside, even if the new owner wants the originals, it would not hurt for them to be delayed a couple of days whilst they are scanned for posterity.

Back to Ian to negotiate with the new owner hoping for a positive response for all!

norvic · Post by **norvic** » 08 Dec 2009 20:40

Eric Casagrande wrote:I'm a little confused here ... (not the first time ).

So Norvic isn't the buyer, but asked for the items on behalf of a buyer?

My local friend, a lurker and only occasional poster on Stampboards forgot his password (hence only occasional poster) and phoned me. While he was still on the phone (the utility of 'speaker' phones') I banged in the "Wanted will write" message, and then wrote to Malcolm when I was off the phone.

As far as I'm concerned nothing is SOLD until the money is transacted, so I used Wanted. Anyway, the current and potential owners are in contact.

howwible · Post by **howwible** » 09 Dec 2009 16:48

To all concerned,
I would glady put some money in to have a cd or pdf file of these documents.Invaluable information thats damn hard to get these days.So if it does go ahead please include me IN..Thanks

Bruce in Widgiemooltha

Stefy · Post by **Stefy** » 09 Dec 2009 22:47

Please count me in as well. Thanks.

mrboggler · Post by **mrboggler** » 10 Dec 2009 09:19

You can add in at least one set for the GOMC,
if it ends up as a CD,then perhaps only 3
one for me,one for Philly,one for Waroff.

but if it ends up as paper copy,make it 5 sets.

Me.
Harry.(No putta)
Jerry (no Putta)
Philly.(Has Putta but would not know where to put it)
Waroff.

The others would have little use for it.and if they really wanted to,could borrow one from us.

Kevin Morgan · Post by **Kevin Morgan** » 10 Dec 2009 10:34

And one set for me please!

sherro · Post by **sherro** » 10 Dec 2009 10:38

Do you get the impression that old Bill should have kept producing these catalogues? Clearly the demand is still there.

A magnanimous gesture on his behalf to approve of copying them. 8)

borneo · Post by **borneo** » 14 Dec 2009 00:20

i am in for a CD/or pdf

Raz · Post by **Raz** » 14 Dec 2009 00:57

I would like a copy or CD or even a DVD of the whole story. Could end up bigger than Ben-Hur!

As "old Bill" has been kind enough to allow his work to be used, I think that the true sharing of Knowledge principle that makes Stampboards such a great place, should trump any other considerations.

If enough people buy them(the CD), perhaps a small present, chosen by someone who knows Bill well, might be a good idea. Even just a card,saying how his work is living on, might be appropriate.

Kiwidude · Post by **Kiwidude** » 14 Dec 2009 07:36

Hi,
Id be interested
Peter

stamps4collectors · Post by **stamps4collectors** » 14 Dec 2009 18:43

I'd be in for a set of the catalogues either in PDF format or on a CD or DVD.

I can also assist in scanning / PDF'ing / burning to CD or DVD; my publishing office in Sydney is in Summer hiatus until January 11 so we have both time and resources.

Global Administrator · Post by **Global Administrator** » 14 Dec 2009 19:44

Raz wrote:
As "old Bill" has been kind enough to allow his work to be used, I think that the true sharing of Knowledge principle that makes Stampboards such a great place, should trump any other considerations.

If enough people buy them (the CD), perhaps a small present, chosen by someone who knows Bill well, might be a good idea. Even just a card, saying how his work is living on, might be appropriate.

I agree.

Brian (stamps4collectors above) worked with and in conjunction with Bill for a VERY long time, even down in Dubbo, and might be able to suggest something suitable re a gift?

Maybe if those who want one paypal $5 or $10 to cover burn cost, packing and mailing to a central bagman (not me, as I'll just lose all the details and I'm overseas in a few days!) then a nice gift can be funded?

Whether a large box of Lindt, or a great bottle of Red or Port, or some classical music CDs etc - whatever Brian thinks Bill would enjoy most. His eyes are very bad so it sadly can't be a great book.

To be honest I was shocked at how far Bill had gone downhill since I last spoke to him only a few months back.

He did not know who I was for quite a while, and when he did, had trouble undestanding me. He is very elderly, but in the past has been very sprightly.

Brian works in a very large commerical printing related operation, and his kind offer of help on this (along with Diver Pete's) would be welcome I am sure. 8) 8)

I personally would pay for a PAPER copy!

800 pages on a PDF with NO INDEX will be all but unusable I think .. ditto with a CD Rom.

DarrenK · Post by **DarrenK** » 14 Dec 2009 20:12

I would be interested in a copy for the Essendon/Broadmedows Philatelic Society. There are several cinderella collectors there that would benefit from this.

Darren

mrboggler · Post by **mrboggler** » 14 Dec 2009 20:18

If they end up as hard copy then $10.00 P/P will be far to little,I would suggest $40.00 per set.as a hard copy.if a disk then it would be much less.
My preference is a Hard copy.much easier to use,but this is from GOM.

stamps4collectors · Post by **stamps4collectors** » 14 Dec 2009 20:28

Global Administrator wrote:
Raz wrote:
As "old Bill" has been kind enough to allow his work to be used, I think that the true sharing of Knowledge principle that makes Stampboards such a great place, should trump any other considerations.

If enough people buy them (the CD), perhaps a small present, chosen by someone who knows Bill well, might be a good idea. Even just a card, saying how his work is living on, might be appropriate.
I agree.

Brian (stamps4collectors above) worked with and in conjunction with Bill for a VERY long time, even down in Dubbo, and might be able to suggest something suitable re a gift?

Maybe if those who want one paypal $5 or $10 to cover burn cost, packing and mailing to a central bagman (not me, as I'll just lose all the details and I'm overseas in a few days!) then a nice gift can be funded?

Whether a large box of Lindt, or a great bottle of Red or Port, or some classical music CDs etc - whatever Brian thinks Bill would enjoy most. His eyes are very bad so it sadly can't be a great book.

To be honest I was shocked at how far Bill had gone downhill since I last spoke to him only a few months back.

He did not know who I was for quite a while, and when he did, had trouble undestanding me. He is very elderly, but in the past has been very sprightly.

Brian works in a very large commerical printing related operation, and his kind offer of help (along with Diver Pete's) on this would be welcome I am sure. 8) 8)

Thanks Glen, I am happy to be involved in any way the group would like me to be.

Sadly, I haven't seen Bill for many years, and was actually thinking of flying out to Dubbo over the Summer holidays to catch up with him.

Bill was fantastic to work for and I learned so much about stamps, publishing, business, especially direct marketing, and of course, life from him over many inspiring years.

One particular saying of Bill's was "Tell a story; sell a stamp" and I've taken it to heart.

His Cinderella price lists were a practical demonstration of Bill's credo; he researched everything he ever sold and this is what makes his price lists such an invaluable reference for collectors now and in the future.

Global Administrator · Post by **Global Administrator** » 14 Dec 2009 20:50

mrboggler wrote:
If they end up as hard copy then $10.00 P/P will be far to little, I would suggest $40.00 per set.as a hard copy

My preference is a Hard copy, much easier to use

Yes 800 pages on a PDF with no index will be totally useless to be honest.

If someone has time to do an A-Z Index THAT would make it a different ball game, as finding the PDF page would then be a cinch.

Bill often repeated the came offer so the first Index to it would suffice. i.e. not all would need be done.

As Bill's pages were all small B5, I assure that means 200 x double sided A4 sheets if done on paper, a far more useable size.

I really think if these were produced they'd sell fairly well as a reference point, and at say $20 or so each set, plus post might well be economic to print via small printer?

I do not feel at that price level it would do other than cover cost, and Bill's comment to me was that these could be duplicated in any way, by any group, as far as he was concerned and that had his blessing.

I am sure pres would consider giving them a plug in his Cinderella Pages in "Stamp News" .. I'll ask him for input, as the SASG do printed catalogues.

If they need to be scanned to run off CD Roms etc, surely that is all a local printer needs to work from?

waroff49 · Post by **waroff49** » 14 Dec 2009 21:46

I'd like a set on CD. I think I could also index them.

pres · Post by **pres** » 15 Dec 2009 00:29

If someone can produce these catalogues as a searchable publication I would certainly be interested in obtaining a cd or set of cd s. I have a full set of the catalogues but have bound them into book form so not much use for copying, and indexing them is one of those jobs I have on my 'to do' list that never seems to get any closer to being done.

I will certainly give them a plug in Cinderella Corner when the time comes

Bill was 91 in November.

stamps4collectors · Post by **stamps4collectors** » 15 Dec 2009 06:30

I have known the printer of Bill's catalogues in Dubbo for many, many years and am contacting him today 'just-in-case' as it would make the task a whole lot easier if he still has the original files, film or plates - it's a long shot, but it would be a very positive starting point.

I doubt if digital files were ever used in the process of production of the price lists - I seem to remember Bill did an awful lot of cut-and-paste. This means it would be almost impossible to produce a searchable PDF - without re-keying the whole thing or doing an OCR text scan. And that would kind of defeat the purpose.

I suspect reprinting digitally in a small run would be the most practical option, though quite costly - and downloadable PDFs from scans would be the cheapest; with additional cost if the PDFs are to be loaded onto CDs or DVDs.

I will report back later with the result from Dubbo.

librarianc · Post by **librarianc** » 15 Dec 2009 06:58

As mentioned in my original email to Browny, I am very interested and will follow this closely to see what the final verdict is on format.

John A

norvic · Post by **norvic** » 15 Dec 2009 07:02

I'm glad it's not me that's still waiting for this to be resolved 8 days after the deal was 'done'.

Brummie · Post by **Brummie** » 15 Dec 2009 07:13

What was the outcome of that deal Norvic? I think you were going to come back with reply from the buyer whether he agreed to sharing.

norvic · Post by **norvic** » 15 Dec 2009 07:47

Brummie wrote:What was the outcome of that deal Norvic? I think you were going to come back with reply from the buyer whether he agreed to sharing.

Malcolm is in contact, as far as I know. I'm out of it, now. Stamp club is closed until January