New Guide & Rarity Ratings for TASMANIA circular datestamps

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New Guide & Rarity Ratings for TASMANIA circular datestamps

Post by tascollector »

Guide to circular date stamps on Tasmanian Pictorial Stamp Issues 1899 - 1913

The Tasmanian Philatelic Society will publish a Guide to circular date stamps on Pictorial Issues, by John Hardinge at the end of January 2015.

The Guide features a completely revised and expanded rarity rating along with much related information, and is heavily illustrated.

Contents

*rarity ratings expanded and revised
* circular date stamp types
* early & late dates of use
* other markings on the Tasmanian pictorial stamps
* transition from the State to the commonwealth period
* many illustrations
* 52 pages full colour.

This work has been developed over many years by Tasmanian postal historian John Hardinge who has previously published rarity ratings for Commonwealth Period postmarks and also the "Post Offices of Tasmania".

The current rarity ratings from the Keith Lancaster book are now almost 30 years old and postmark collectors will know for example in the un-rated group, while some are extremely common, some are not very easy to find.

Likewise in the RRRR group, some might sell for $300 - $400 while a small number are extremely rare and may sell for $3000+. There has long been a need for a more finely graded and up-dated rarity rating.

The new ratings expand the currently unclassified group into two section, and an extra "RRRRR" classification has been added. Each group is subdivided into 3 sub-categories.

Around 50 individual cds not listed in Lancaster have been listed and classified. Students of the "Green Books" will know that cds for larger offices such as Burnie, Queenstown, Wynyard etc were grouped together in Lancaster's list but there are a number of different cds for such offices.

Amongst these, some are scarce or rare but collectors generally have no way of identifying them.

Other topics include listings of other markings such as BNs and fiscal use, cds theoretically possible but not yet seen, early and late dates, cds colour variations, manuscript cancels and more.

The transition from State to Commonwealth stamps is very well documented, based on as-yet unpublished research about the final printings of the Pictorials and research conducted on the TPS Bulletin Board about early dates on 1d Kangaroo stamps.

PRE-PUBLICATION OFFER

All financial TPS members will receive a copy free of charge replacing the December Courier.

We have also printed additional copies which are available for sale at a pre-publication price of $25 plus postage. After 31 January, the price will be $30 plus Postage.

Full Details are available at http://www.tps.org.au/guide-cds-pictorials/
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Global Administrator »

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Long awaited Peter .. great news.
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Many thanks Glen. I was actually just up-loading an image to photobucket but you beat me to it!

Here are a couple of images of some nice Tasmanian date stamps from the Guide :

Image

Image
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by electric chook »

Order has been sent.

Funds will be transferred tomorrow.

Great work. :shock:

Absolutely needed. Thanks. :D

Cheers,
Frank (Electric Chook)
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Jack »

I've bought a copy.
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by hutch »

Just placed my order and payment as well!

Thanks Tascollector!

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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Up-date

Thanks to all those who have placed pre-publication orders. Publication is on track, so we expect to post orders first week in Feb - we will email you when your copy(s) are in the mail.

Theres till time to order a pre-publication copy at $25, saving $5. This offer closes 31/1/2015. Just visit https://www.tps.org.au/guide-cds-pictorials/.

If you have any questions, please feel free to post them here.

Here's a small sample - part of the 'Date Stamp Type" guide.
Image
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Thank you to all who have now placed orders. We will post your orders the first week in February as previously advised.

There are still a few days to go before our pre-publication offer at $25 expires on 31 Jan 2015.

One Auction house has already started using the new rarity ratings

http://www.www.stampboards.com/images/tsauctions/auction/index.php?

For more information or to order a copy go here http://www.tps.org.au/guide-cds-pictorials/

Pete
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by PHK »

I have placed an order and completed the bank transfer today, appreciate you posting this information to StampBoards.

Peter King.
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by snaws »

My copy arrived today. :mrgreen:

I would highly recommend this to anyone remotely interested in Tas postmarks.

What a great work.
Regards snaws
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by dporter-stamps »

tascollector,

Order placed & paid by paypal.

regards,
David Porter
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by billlel »

Great offer'
Order placed and monies deposited.
Thankyou. Bill.
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Philanthropist »

Order just placed,
and Bank transfer completed
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Thanks to those who have ordered their copy and thanks for the positive comments. You should have an acknowledgement email by now if you have placed an order.

As previously advised, we will post orders this coming week.

The Pre-publication offer at $25 plus postage ends tomorrow but copies will continue to be available for the foreseeable future at the standard price of $30 from 1 Feb.

We'll set up a page for additions and any amendments and will let you know when thats on line.

I am also hoping to gradually put together some further illustrations of some of the harder-to-spot cds, especially the Hobart and Launceston date stamps.

These are the ones we all relegate to our collections of 'less interesting' postmarks as we assume they are all very common.

The truth is, there is probably not one complete collection of all the Hobart, Launceston, and perhaps Zeehan date stamps in existence ( please let me know if I am wrong!). There is also a lot of them!

Some are actually quite scarce and I am sure many collectors would follow these with more interest if they knew what to look for.


Pete
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Caddyman »

I have just ordered one. Looking forward to receiving it.
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Corrections and new discoveries
We will post any corrections and further information here http://tps.org.au/bb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1133.

The new Rarity rating scale for cds on Tasmanian Pictorial stamps
The rating scale is available here and can be downloaded as a PDF. http://www.tps.org.au/references-2/cds-tasmanian-pictorials-rarity-rating-scale/

The actual listing of over 600 date stamps, early and late dates, cds types and much more related information is now available for $30 plus postage . http://www.tps.org.au/guide-cds-pictorials/
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by dporter-stamps »

tascollector wrote:Thanks to those who have ordered their copy and thanks for the positive comments. You should have an acknowledgement email by now if you have placed an order.

As previously advised, we will post orders this coming week.

The Pre-publication offer at $25 plus postage ends tomorrow but copies will continue to be available for the foreseeable future at the standard price of $30 from 1 Feb.

We'll set up a page for additions and any amendments and will let you know when thats on line.

I am also hoping to gradually put together some further illustrations of some of the harder-to-spot cds, especially the Hobart and Launceston date stamps.

These are the ones we all relegate to our collections of 'less interesting' postmarks as we assume they are all very common.

The truth is, there is probably not one complete collection of all the Hobart, Launceston, and perhaps Zeehan date stamps in existence ( please let me know if I am wrong!). There is also a lot of them!

Some are actually quite scarce and I am sure many collectors would follow these with more interest if they knew what to look for.


Pete
Pete,
I haven't received an email yet, can you check that you got my order & payment.

Thanks,
David
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

David,
No problem - I do have your order and payment details. I'm sorry - it seems I intercepted your order email on my phone and I cant see an acknowledgement in my sent emails on my home computer.

I am posting in batches of 20 or so and will be shipping your order within the next couple of days, if not tomorrow. I'll email you when your copy is in the mail.
Best regards,
Pete
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by dporter-stamps »

No problem Pete,
Just wanted to know you got it ok.

regards,
David
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by hutch »

Got my copy today!

Looks very interesting and very informative :D

Now all I need are more Tassie postmarks to check out!!

Thanks tascollector.

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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Thanks Hutch.

Good luck with your postmark hunting. Now you know about the rare 'unknowns" !

Pete
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Philanthropist »

My two, too, have arrived. :wink:
Thanks
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by billlel »

Mine arrived today. Many thanks to tascollector and your members.

The hunt begins...
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by cyber »

I received my copy yesterday. This looks excellent.

Thanks TPS!

:D
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by dporter-stamps »

received mine yesterday, so far all my postmarks are the common type, will be checking the rest over the weekend.

thanks,
David
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Global Administrator »

Thank to Peter and TPS for this new work, and highly recommended to all here who collect the field. :mrgreen:

One positive comment is, my copy has been lying on my desk for a week or 2 and the cover, despite many attempts to straighten it - looks like this -
Image

I owned and published stamp and coin magazines in the past and know printers well, and they have at their disposal HUNDREDS of different grades of paper and light board, and usually use the one specified by client.

This board clearly "curls" badly as can be seen, and printer will have board of same GSM weight for same price, that is rigid for more secure library storage if any future print runs take place.

Weight with envelope still under the magic 250 gram mailing rate, so for future copies even if he has a slightly heavier GSM you'll be fine I think. 8)

But RIGIDITY is what I'd be insisting on for outer covers. :mrgreen:
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Caddyman »

I'm not sure if this should go here, or start a new thread. Moderators please move the post if appropriate.

I received my copy of the book last week and have found something new in my collection already.

The early date for TPO No 4, Type 3 is given as 3.7.1912. Here is (I believe) a significantly earlier use.

Image

I still have plenty more to look through.
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Glen,
thanks for the feedback. I think the issue may be that we had a coating applied to the front and back covers to protect from marks and stains etc.

In any case, as we will most likely run to second printing given the good response so far, I will be speaking to our printer about both a slightly heavier cover and also how to deal with this curling issue. You are right, we have some room to add a little more weight without pushing the postage over the 250 g weight step.

The covers on my own copies have straightened out after being left under a pile of other books in my library for a few weeks now .

Pete

Global Administrator wrote:Thank to Peter and TPS for this new work, and highly recommended to all here who collect the field. :mrgreen:

One positive comment is, my copy has been lying on my desk for a week or 2 and the cover, despite many attempts to straighten it - looks like this -
Image

I owned and published stamp and coin magazines in the past and know printers well, and they have at their disposal HUNDREDS of different grades of paper and light board, and usually use the one specified by client.

This board clearly "curls" badly as can be seen, and printer will have board of same GSM weight for same price, that is rigid for more secure library storage if any future print runs take place.

Weight with envelope still under the magic 250 gram mailing rate, so for future copies even if he has a slightly heavier GSM you'll be fine I think. 8)

But RIGIDITY is what I'd be insisting on for outer covers. :mrgreen:
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Caddyman,
Well spotted! Thanks for sharing this much earlier date.

We have a topic on the TPS Bulletin Board for corrections and discoveries here https://tps.org.au/bb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1133, however I will leave it to you whether to post it there or not. If not, can I add it on your behalf?

In any case, I would like to pass this discovery on to the author, if thats OK with you?

I expect we will run to a second printing and we plan to add any changes or new information so i we will add this to the list of amendments.

Its nice to see new discoveries being made. Its quite a good example too .

Pete
Caddyman wrote:I'm not sure if this should go here, or start a new thread. Moderators please move the post if appropriate.

I received my copy of the book last week and have found something new in my collection already.

The early date for TPO No 4, Type 3 is given as 3.7.1912. Here is (I believe) a significantly earlier use.

Image

I still have plenty more to look through.
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Global Administrator »

tascollector wrote:Glen,

thanks for the feedback. I think the issue may be that we had a coating applied to the front and back covers to protect from marks and stains etc.

In any case, as we will most likely run to second printing given the good response so far, I will be speaking to our printer about both a slightly heavier cover and also how to deal with this curling issue. You are right, we have some room to add a little more weight without pushing the postage over the 250 g weight step.

The covers on my own copies have straightened out after being left under a pile of other books in my library for a few weeks now .

Pete
Pete .. that will be the answer. :mrgreen:

'After market' varnishing by printer will never be as effective as using pre-varnished factory board from paper-maker, and indeed the latter is probably cheaper anyway to the printer if you do a re-run. :idea:

To a printer a box of 300gsm or whatever board is much of a muchness money wise. Labor is his biggest expense.

Actually varnish the board of a heavily use book is BAD news really as the varnish layer quickly scratches and scuffs and ALWAYS peels off as we can see here -

This is my SECOND office copy of the "new" ACSC Roos book - pretty banged about and as you can see, the varnish layer has all started to delaminate in corners, and down middle.

Copy #1 fell apart in 9 months, the amount I use it! :mrgreen:

Glen
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Caddyman »

Hi Pete,

I'll work out how to post on your board tonight and share the information there - along with anything else that turns up.

The book is a great resource - I am glad that I could contribute something. By the way, my cover is curling too.

Ron
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Brit-Col »

When you do a reprint you'll want to correct "datetamps" in the title to "date stamps". Otherwise, well done to TPS and all involved.

I included and recommended this publication in my presentation on Tasmanian philately to my local club a couple of weeks ago.

Thanks for your hospitality during my recent stay in Hobart.

BC
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Many thanks Brit-Col,

Thanks for bringing our Guide to the attention of your club!

As far as the term 'datestamp' is concerned, the editorial committee decided to use it as one word rather than 'date stamp' .

Its spelled 'Datestamp' on the final version of the front cover though there was a typo in an earlier version.

I am sure its arguable to use the term as two words, but that was a conscious decision reached by considering modern usage in the literature - it can certainly be found spelled as one work or two. No offence intended, but I hope the content becomes the main focus of discussion, not the semantics of the word 'datestamp', if you know what I mean :D .


Pete
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by dwhopper »

My copy has arrived in Canada.
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Global Administrator »

I agree 'datestamp' and 'date stamp' are used in about equal number, indeed datestamp is how I always type it, and it makes sense to use that.

Americans tend to shorten perfectly good words rather than expand them, so I am intrigued. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

We can forever thank our American cousins for murdering English spellings in 100s of ways like gray, color, catalog, center, liter, jewelry, standardize etc, etc, and should be thankful they are working on many other perfectly good words. :mrgreen:

In my lifetime we will see "yot" being perfectly acceptable there - why not?
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by snaws »

Hi Glen & tascollector.

I think you have miss understood Brit-Col.
Brit-Col wrote:When you do a reprint you'll want to correct "datetamps" in the title to "date stamps". Otherwise, well done to TPS and all involved.

I included and recommended this publication in my presentation on Tasmanian philately to my local club a couple of weeks ago.

Thanks for your hospitality during my recent stay in Hobart.

BC
The spelling on the initial book shown is incorrect missing the S of Stamp in Datestamps.
Global Administrator wrote:
Image
Don't be bashful ... add a pic!

Long awaited Peter .. great news.
It must have been picked up before final printing as my copy is spelt correctly.
Regards snaws
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

I think I acknowledged Brit-Col's two points - there was a typo in the heading 'datetamps' which is correct as you and Brit-Col both have pointed out, but we decided as an Editorial decision to use the form of words 'datestamps' rather than ' date stamps' which I also understood Brit-Col was suggesting.

We corrected the original typo before the publication went to print. The image posted here was from an early version before proof reading.

All good now I hope, and thanks for your comment.

Pete
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Global Administrator »

Got it.

Well I hope they kept a few covers of original spelling.

Ross Ewington should run them a a couple of auction lots and donate the proceeds to TPS. :mrgreen:

Probably get $50 apiece! Collectors love "Errors"!
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Jack »

It's excellent, many thanks for it.
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Global Administrator »

Peter, can you please advise me the HIGHEST figure you are aware of being obtained for a Tassie cds on a pictorial, and better still, arrange ASAP for a scan of that or a high $$ figure if possible. Highest rez possible please.

I’ll run that in ‘Stamp News’ and the ‘Philatelic Exporter’, with attribution. Will create a lot of interest in these from new quarters, I am sure. :mrgreen:

Had Gary Watson on the phone last night, giving me the scoop re the Arthur Gray KGV auction below, and asked him and the most he ever got at Pretige was $2700 or so as he recalls, and said Ross Ewington would have done better in the past!

http://www.stampboards.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=61672

Thanks in advance – Kevin on my back right now for deadline, so hope you or others can assist!

Glen
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Brit-Col »

tascollector wrote: No offence intended, but I hope the content becomes the main focus of discussion, not the semantics of the word 'datestamp', if you know what I mean :D .

Pete
In case it matters, which it doesn't, I was really only concerned with the missing 's', which is missing no longer. I am happy to defer to the judgement of the editorial committee on whether it should be one word or two.

Having said that I completely agree with Pete (and no offence taken), let's appreciate the effort that went into this publication and focus on the content.

Sorry for having inadvertently derailed the thread.

BC
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Sorry, am away for the long weekend and have just seen this.

Springs sold for $3200 around 2006. I am sure Teepookana sold for more a year or two later, possibly $3400 but I would have to check. Glaziers Bay Type 2 has also sold for over $3000.
I have hi-res scan of Springs which I am happy to provide but not the other two.

Interestingly, the rarest with only one copy known, Peppermint Bay, has never appeared at auction so its market value is not known.

Unfortunately I am away from home until Monday but I will send a 600 DPI scan of Spings as soon as I get home. I will also see if I can firm up on realisations for Teepookana and Glaziers Bay. Hope this meets your deadline.


Pete

Global Administrator wrote:Peter, can you please advise me the HIGHEST figure you are aware of being obtained for a Tassie cds on a pictorial, and better still, arrange ASAP for a scan of that or a high $$ figure if possible. Highest rez possible please.

I’ll run that in ‘Stamp News’ and the ‘Philatelic Exporter’, with attribution. Will create a lot of interest in these from new quarters, I am sure. :mrgreen:

Had Gary Watson on the phone last night, giving me the scoop re the Arthur Gray KGV auction below, and asked him and the most he ever got at Pretige was $2700 or so as he recalls, and said Ross Ewington would have done better in the past!

http://www.stampboards.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=61672

Thanks in advance – Kevin on my back right now for deadline, so hope you or others can assist!

Glen
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Global Administrator »

Thanks so much Peter for the help. :)

Deadline was midday today, so I needed to hold this over for next month, as that will allow some good scans to be sourced, and hopefully an accurate idea of the full prices obtained for the few biggies. :D

Ross E said he also might be able to assist. 8)

A general article will help create some totally new interest in the field, and unearth quite a few left field buyers of the book.

I run the same article in a UK magazine as well, so they seem to gravitate to these sorts of area if they read something on them. :wink:

Glen
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Glen

That sounds good.

Will get on to it Monday and between Ross and I we should be able to give you some useful information and scans.

Pete
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Not Bruce »

Here's one I found earlier, seems a remote spot...

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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by Global Administrator »

Oddly the collecting passion for cds is mostly restricted to the large pictorials - even though your Platypus stamp is cat far higher and is readily saleable as fine cds used on its own. These were prohibited from postal use only a year or so later as I recall.

Peter or others can advise for sure but my GUESS is Zeehan is about 5th or 6th most popular town by number of strikes you see. :mrgreen:

Code letter L might be scarce .. have no idea. 8)
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Yes, Zeehan was an important town back in the late 1800's and early 1900's and postmarks are commonly seen.
It was Tasmania's third largest town due to the discovery of rich silver mines, though still remote and initially only accessible by sea. The West Cost of Tasmania at that time had many mines. Zeehan was an important Centre for many much smaller mining towns.

Zeehan has the third largest number of different date stamps of any Tasmanian town during the mining boom around this period, after Hobart and Launceston, reflecting the size of the population.

There are at least 16 different datestamps recorded from 1896 until the 1970s for Zeehan. Before 1896, the cds was "Mount Zeehan" .

The example shown is one of two cds (type 1) with 'solid' stops' but I think it is the first of these, which is recorded with a number of codes A, D, K, L, O, T, V & no code. Its known from 1896 to 1937. A also known inverted. No code after 1911.

In an un-published work by John Hardinge, author of our recent "CDS on Tasmanian Pictorials" guide its rated as R on a scale from R to 4R, so this one is not common. Some are very common.

I dont think the code makes any difference to the rarity.

Pity its not a complete strike but still nice to have.

Pete
Global Administrator wrote:Oddly the collecting passion for cds is mostly restricted to the large pictorials - even though your Platypus stamp is cat far higher and is readily saleable as fine cds used on its own. These were prohibited from postal use only a year or so later as I recall.

Peter or others can advise for sure but my GUESS is Zeehan is about 5th or 6th most popular town by number of strikes you see. :mrgreen:

Code letter L might be scarce .. have no idea. 8)
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by tascollector »

Global Administrator wrote:Oddly the collecting passion for cds is mostly restricted to the large pictorials - even though your Platypus stamp is cat far higher and is readily saleable as fine cds used on its own. These were prohibited from postal use only a year or so later as I recall.
You are quite right about the focus on cds on the Tas Pictorials. Our "Guide " explains that:

1. the pictorals are large enough to show complete stikes easily while other Tasmanian stamps are really too small to show full strikes

2. until 1900, the cds was usually not applied to the stamp, which was canceled with a barred numeral. As a result, pre-1900 cds are much harder to find - the vast majority of full covers were not kept, only the stamps which showed a numeral not the cds. In 1900 the post office changed its policy and abandoned the barred numerals, requiring the the date stamp be used to cancel the stamp itself so we see many more cds ( on stamps) from then on

3. the colours of most of the pictorials show off postmarks particularly well - they 'look good'

4. as a result, a practice of collecting Tasmanian cds on only Pictorial issues has developed - its become an entrenched tradition amongst post mark collectors

This tends to mean that prices for cds on pictorials are higher than the same strikes on other stamps as the market is much larger.

Pete
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by CDragon »

Re Tasmanian pictorials on cover - A quick question for anyone who knows. Are pictorials cancelled with TPO cancels on cover (letters or PC's) scarce/rare?
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Re: New Guide & rarity ratings for TASMANIA circular datesta

Post by traralgon3844 »

Just posted elsewhere, but saw this thread as well.

It had me scratching my head for a while. :lol:

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