German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by 60366 »

And lastly, postcard mailed Eger (cz Cheb) 7.4.1945. This would have been intercepted by the Americans (WW2 ended four weeks later 8.5.1945) ,it was detained and censored by the military authorities and put back into the postal system and is known as Uberroller mail. Old Duffer1 referred to examples in the Western area in his Allies in Germany thread.
ABE56677-E0E0-4B6B-BB76-1C66F6A7C039.jpeg
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by OldDuffer1 »

Nice example- interesting that they didn't normally deface the "head"!
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by johnrcrow »

Tremendous inserts. Some very interesting covers and cards.

Seems we have the Sudentenland thread running here so maybe we need to make a thread title change?

Off to find all my covers and eek out anything relevant for expert evaluation.

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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Old Architect »

60366 wrote: 20 Nov 2021 00:29 Image
I was under the impression that ALL of the travelling post offices were under the control of the main "Amt für Volksmobilität," (People's Mobility Office - Stemple on this letter) within an assigned Gau & Kries. Is that correct? Seems like a messy approach, though given the circumstances of an ever-changing border or new territorial boundary, a necessary method,

+++WOW! Amazing what get's posted when you blink. A fantastic cache of history. Thanks 60366!!

Additionally, if you're considering adding the Sudentenland issues to the thread, which I am in favor of, are we also considering the great array of overprints? That would be amazing.
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by maptrekker »

Thanks for posting the pages. Beautiful collection.
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by johnrcrow »

Thanks to all who contributed to thread as we won the poster of the month!

Having located the Sudetenland lot, I add a few more scans, for comment.


Sud a.
sud a.png





Sud b.
sud b.png





Sud c.

sud c.png





Sud d.

sud d.png





Sud e. Film envelope.

sud e.png
.








Sud f.

sud f.jpg
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Old Architect »

Amazing collection of cancels John! "Sud c & d" with the late date printing company cancel are terrific. I realize this may seem a bit off-topic but, apparently Stiepel was printing in Reichenberg decades prior to occupation. Can't find anything postwar, though. Too bad one can't put the "Bücherzettel" in context.
Stiepel Reichenberg Print.jpg
Art Deco Lithograph from Stiepel Printing from 1911, Sold for £4,000 in 2016 at a Christie's auction

Does anyone think an attempt to add all of the known Gau hubs, i.e. Mährisch-Östrau, Reichenberg, Rumberg, Karlsbad, Albertham, Maffersdorf, etc, might be too adventurous? I'm for adding-in the kitchen sink.
This thread is continually becoming the one-stop place for this entire era.
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by johnrcrow »

OldArchitect.

Can you expand on the idea of including the hubs?

Maybe inserting some examples?

John


Adding a few more Sudentenland of interest.

ndew sudent 13.jpg







xx.png







xxx.png
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Old Architect »

Hi John~~
Perhaps my choice of terms was confusing. However, it appears you understood the intent with your post. What we know is that within each Gau was a Kries, all the way down to Block & Haus. My comment was directed towards the main postal centers with cancels and overprints being sub-categories. There are differing initial overprints on Czech stamps during the Anschluss & I thought we might highlight some of those differences in addition to the main occupation stamps that followed. There are several pages in the Michels catalog that cover these. My ancient book needs replacing (ugh).
1938 Anschluss Sudetenland Rumburg CZ (2).jpg
1938 Fugner Reichenberg Blocks.jpg
I.E. These Rumberg overprints vs. say those of Reichenberg, etc. The differences in type-face fonts, designs, cancels, etc., though very short-lived, could prove extremely valuable.
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by johnrcrow »

I am all for adding such content.

I am interested in how much material will be offered.

I, for one, will have to re-examine my stamps to see the her thee is anything suitable.

You should see my Michel´s. At least they are used.....

John
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by 60366 »

John- well done on starting this thread and winning poster of the month.

Few more Sudetenland to show.
First another Bahnpost cover. Window cover originated Gablonz (cz Jabonec Nad Nisou) and cancelled with a Reichenbrg-Tannwald Zug? 3 Feb 1938 (? 1939) Bp cancel. Rated at 12pf.
375AC304-90AB-4030-8395-96C646A0EC1D.jpeg
The Sudenten German Party began to issue its own postage stamps in the Asch and Rumburg areas as early as 21st Sept. 1938 prior to it being ceded by Czechoslovakia on 1st Oct 1938. Czechoslovakian stamps ,with or without overprints,were allowed up until 20th Oct. Local official Sudetenland issues were produced in Asch, Karlsbad, Konstaninsbad, Nikalasdorf, Rumburg and Reichenberg-Maffersdorf. Other non official local issues were also produced.
Here are three, albeit philatelic, cards postmarked Asch 1 30th Sept, 1938 with Czechoslovakian stamps overprinted with new values. Cachet (roughly translated) “ We have thrown off the yoke now we are free and stay free. Post Office Asch 21 September 1938.”
D3D20DF9-7BEC-427D-A773-4E56B35D08BB.jpeg
3EB4280B-4DC7-42C6-B49D-73C14C53682D.jpeg
4F7D6DCB-B121-4616-A88A-B4335FBB665D.jpeg
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by maptrekker »

This old Stampboards thread may still be of interest:

Catalogue for Czechoslovakian 1945 liberation stamps
https://www.stampboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=52802
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by johnrcrow »

Thanks Map.

Anyone with actual stamps ?

Can see this thread encompassing all.....

John
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Panterra »

Bohemia-45-Hitler-bday-MS.jpg
Protectorate of Bohemia & Moravia, 1945 Hitler's birthday, minisheet.



Though I'm collecting B&M, I had never heard of this issue, and don't see it mentioned in Gibbons nor the German Philex catalogue. But a dealer had it in stock, so I bought it.

Anyone else familiar with this? Is it in the category of "prepared for issue but not issued"? Though surely B&M was still under control of the Third Reich in mid-April, so perhaps it was issued. But if so, why is it not in the SG and Philex catalogue?

The two "dirt" spots are not on the stamp, but on my scanner.

The sheet has full gum on the back, but is not engraved, so perhaps photogravure or lithography?
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by johnrcrow »

Panterra.

Very interesting and I hope someone can shed light on this.

20th April, Hitlers Birthday... 20. IV. 1945 as on sheet.

A smartly produced item too... obviously intended for some release and than caught in ´events`.

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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Old Architect »

I believe your sheet is a "Cinderella" issue, that's why it's not in the catalog. Yes, nicely made as many are. Hitler was dead just days later.
The last Reich issues, at the PO's around the same date, were the SA & SS men (below) in red so, perhaps hearkening back to those colors? while using the 1944 Bohemia/Moravia style layout over a photograph (further down)? The eagle can't be correct either...an EXACT Feldpost style with splayed legs & slanted wing feathers (furthest down) vs. State issue. Highly unlikely.
Previous details from several actual issues = Cinderella (fantasy piece).
IMG_1026.JPG
IMG_1579.JPG
1942 Luftfeldpost.jpg
All the elements are there. Seems the most likely scenario.
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by johnrcrow »

Nicely done Old Architect.

A composite maybe long before Photoshop

Reminds me to dig out some Luftfeldpost overprints for the thread.

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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Old Architect »

johnrcrow wrote: 09 Jan 2022 19:56 Nicely done Old Architect.
A composite maybe long before Photoshop
John
Thanks John. Actually, I should have mentioned the most telling "Cinderella" feature, the portrait of AH himself. As he aged his portraits followed. The photo depicted is obviously from an earlier time, youthful & austere, most likely pre-war. If so inclined, I could probably find it in a Hoffman or Riefenstahl album ("Triumph des Willens?"). Hitler collected royalties on all his images, including stamps, making him a multi-millionaire before the war even began!
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by gavin-h »

Panterra wrote: 08 Jan 2022 17:11
Image
Protectorate of Bohemia & Moravia, 1945 Hitler's birthday, minisheet.



Though I'm collecting B&M, I had never heard of this issue, and don't see it mentioned in Gibbons nor the German Philex catalogue. But a dealer had it in stock, so I bought it.

Anyone else familiar with this? Is it in the category of "prepared for issue but not issued"? Though surely B&M was still under control of the Third Reich in mid-April, so perhaps it was issued. But if so, why is it not in the SG and Philex catalogue?

The two "dirt" spots are not on the stamp, but on my scanner.

The sheet has full gum on the back, but is not engraved, so perhaps photogravure or lithography?
Complete fantasy issue. Doubtless produced in the last 20 years, probably in Central-Eastern Europe with the sole aim of defrauding collectors. :idea:
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by OldDuffer1 »

Old Architect wrote: 10 Jan 2022 11:11
Thanks John. Actually, I should have mentioned the most telling "Cinderella" feature, the portrait of AH himself. As he aged his portraits followed. The photo depicted is obviously from an earlier time, youthful & austere, most likely pre-war. If so inclined, I could probably find it in a Hoffman or Riefenstahl album ("Triumph des Willens?"). Hitler collected royalties on all his images, including stamps, making him a multi-millionaire before the war even began!
Very interesting:

"How Rich Was Hitler and is someone getting rich off his royalties today? Many people don't realize that aside from being one of the most evil people in history, Adolf Hitler was also one of the richest authors of all time. The first royalties from Hitler's bestselling book, Mein Kampf, funded the early Nazi party's rise to power and helped Hitler secure his future power with bribes and gifts given to prominent German political figures. Mein Kampf would go on to sell over 10 million copies worldwide. The royalties gave Hitler a vast personal fortune which he used to fund a lavish lifestyle that included a fleet of Mercedes and several luxurious mansions across his empire. Furthermore, Hitler made millions licensing his image to his own government for the use on things like stamps and political posters. It should be noted that in addition to his personal wealth, Hitler and the Nazis also had access to vast amounts of stolen property, precious metals, and priceless works of art but for this article we are going to focus on how much Hitler made personally, from legal endeavors, during his lifetime. And finally who is cashing his royalty checks today?"
https://www.celebritynetworth.com/articles/celebrity/rich-hitler/

Apparently any royalties that continue to accrue are donated to charities. Sadly "Mein Kampf" still sells well (particularly as an e-book).
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Old Architect »

OldDuffer1 wrote: 10 Jan 2022 22:51
Very interesting:

"How Rich Was Hitler and is someone getting rich off his royalties today?" Many people don't realize that aside from being one of the most evil people in history, Adolf Hitler was also one of the richest authors of all time.
https://www.celebritynetworth.com/articles/celebrity/rich-hitler/
Apparently any royalties that continue to accrue are donated to charities. Sadly "Mein Kampf" still sells well (particularly as an e-book).
Thanks OldDuffer1. Nice article regarding current royalties on the sale of Mein Kampf. The book was reissued, in Germany roughly 6-years?? ago. It was made exactly like the original in gilt blue cloth. The German government seemed as if they were finally coming to grips with the horror of the Third Reich period &, in that acknowledgement, made reprints as an historical record, not as a for-profit enterprise.

To your comment regarding copies currently in foreign countries, you are correct. My experience in the Middle East, particularly Egypt, had bookstores with piles of Mein Kampf as the main book on display just a few years ago. I couldn't believe my eyes & the idea of peddling this most racist propagandist tool still haunts me. Many don't realize that during WWII the Palestinians went to Germany, visiting with Himmler, to learn how to manufacture death camps for their own "end Lösung" (final solution). Some people just can't let peace into their hearts.
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Phil J »

B9B846B5-94BE-4380-93F4-69204195C73D.jpeg
FA44D940-3E89-4CEA-ABA7-D852BC6CB86A.jpeg
BD4E871A-80C1-430F-8993-2509B59DC577.jpeg
Hi, I have some unusual German stamps which were originally bought at auction about 30 years.
They are in the original Auction folders, but there is a price paid but not much other info.
I can’t find these exact ones in the Stanley Gibbons Catalogue.
Does anyone know these, and are they rare/ valuable now, the auction prices would have been quite high for the time.
Cheers PhilJ
BD4E871A-80C1-430F-8993-2509B59DC577.jpeg
[/img]
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Old Architect »

Phil J wrote: 30 Jul 2022 12:14 Hi, I have some unusual German stamps which were originally bought at auction about 30 years.
They are in the original Auction folders, but there is a price paid but not much other info.
I can’t find these exact ones in the Stanley Gibbons Catalogue.
Does anyone know these, and are they rare/ valuable now, the auction prices would have been quite high for the time.
Cheers PhilJ
The bottom pair are the last stamps the 3rd Reich ever produced & were issued on the actual last days of the war. I've never seen them imperforate but, perhaps a modification due to the society being strained in the final days of April 1945? Can't answer that one but, know there are fakes running around. If memory serves, I recall several crates were salvaged by the allies while the Russians destroyed the majority of them in Berlin.
Not too uncommon a pair but super rare used since only day(s) were left before the Reich collapsed. Below are some originals in my collection.
1945 Last Stamps.JPG
I've seen these pairs go for around $12-25US on eBay (a tad pricy in my book). The rest look like "Cinderellas." Never seen a feldpost strictly for the SS, as they moved about constantly, the perfs are poorly aligned (Czech looking & very small) + the run numbers are all the same.
Some here collect Cinderellas but, my initial thoughts are they may not be worth much as postwar printed "collector objects." Maybe I'm wrong!?!
Hope this helps!
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Phil J »

Hi, thanks very much, this is a great help. I bought a large collection and there are about 8 quality books , up to 1945. I will post some more. These ones came from a reputable auction house and they paid a lot, which probably means nothing.
I have a page listed as “German errors” and a set with a code Mi S584- 589( Hitler booklets), and a number of others that are not listed in the SG Catalogue. This might be a Michel reference.
Thanks again for your help,
Cheers Phil
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Day »

Hi All

Hopefully I’m on somewhat of the correct thread.

I have a question on German occupation of Jersey and Guernsey.

I have looked on eBay but I cannot find any covers with the German franked stamp on the cover.

I can find covers/ and FDC with just the Jersey or Guernsey postage mark.

I wonder what I have here.

Many thanks for any advice
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Day »

A couple more photos.

Thanks
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Day »

Apologies they are upside down!!!
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Old Architect »

Obviously post war. Why else would the Kanalinseln (Channel Islands) have the 1940-1945 date with a non-German cancel of 1943? Seems odd that the stamps are original too. Very inexpensive at the time + the large eagle is stamped at the same point precisely on it's wing tip. But why promote the Reich...and in English? Can't answer that one. Cinderellas perhaps? If something "smells fishy" it usually is.
If we're lucky maybe Glen can provide some of his amazing insights.
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by Day »

Yes. I can’t work it out.

Was in amongst some Karl Hennig items if this makes a difference.

Look forward to replies.

Thx
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by tacomabob »

I hope this is the right thread to get an answer to my question.
If you can read my scan of the 1946 Numerical Issue, the cancellation
states " VOR DEM UMZUG VERORDNUNG No.16 LESSEN" which translates to
"Read Ordinance No.16 Before Moving" Does anyone happen to know
anything about Ordinance No.16 ? I believe Hamburg was in the British Zone.
occupation20230719.jpeg
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Re: German Occupation postage stamps, Besetzungsausgaben 1939-45

Post by gavin-h »

Day wrote: 30 Nov 2022 02:33 Hi All

Hopefully I’m on somewhat of the correct thread.

I have a question on German occupation of Jersey and Guernsey.

I have looked on eBay but I cannot find any covers with the German franked stamp on the cover.

I can find covers/ and FDC with just the Jersey or Guernsey postage mark.

I wonder what I have here.

Many thanks for any advice
Image
Image
I've only just seen this post.

The swastika cancels are unfortunately totally bogus.

Legitimate Channel Islands cards with genuine addressees, stamps, and Island cancels. BUT sadly adulterated (RUINED!!!) by the recent addition of German stamps and bogus cancels, produced ONLY to defraud collectors. Probably produced in Eastern Europe in the last 20 years.
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